| John Terry Case 12:43 - Jun 25 with 2783 views | daveB |
John Terry racism trial legal team mull 'bad character' bid
John Terry's legal team might make a bad character application against Anton Ferdinand during his racism trial, a court has heard.
The ex-England captain, 31, will stand trial at Westminster Magistrates' Court in 9 July accused of a racially-aggravated public order offence.
Mr Terry's barrister, George Carter-Stephenson QC, has now said he is considering making the application.
Bad character applications are used to cast doubt on a witness's evidence.
The trial relates to a comment allegedly made and caught on camera to the Queens Park Rangers defender when the two teams played last October. |  | | |  |
| John Terry Case on 12:51 - Jun 25 with 2724 views | hoopstilidie |
Water muddying tactics I guess. Will they be bringing up the Diouf & co nightclub fracas recently as evidence of his bad character or have I missed something else "pertinent"?
When all's said and done I doubt the truth of the incident will have any bearing on the outcome of the trial, the smarter legal team will win regardless. |  |
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| John Terry Case on 12:52 - Jun 25 with 2715 views | Antti_Heinola |
They can do what they want. The evidence is damning. |  |
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| John Terry Case on 12:55 - Jun 25 with 2692 views | ultramagnetic |
hahah and terry has no bad character or his family |  | | |
| John Terry Case on 13:02 - Jun 25 with 2651 views | isawqpratwcity |
What does that mean? That Anton Ferdinand is of "bad character" and not to be believed? |  |
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| John Terry Case on 13:03 - Jun 25 with 2644 views | Toast_R |
Admirable consoling of Cole and Young yesterday. He's good at dealing with his team mates' misses... |  | | |
| John Terry Case on 13:05 - Jun 25 with 2632 views | rcap |
Hmmm. Bad character is evidence of previous convictions, cautions or "misconduct" (normally investigated but non-prosecuted allegations), or of a disposition to do misconduct. But you can only get it in if it's important explanatory evidence, or if it's of substantial probative value to an important matter in issue.
The only use I can see for this is if there's something that Terry's legal team have that relates to Ferdinand's credibility - eg. that he's previously made unsubstantiated complaints. But there's been no media coverage of anything like that. The fact that Ferdinand has previously been in trouble with the police (if he has - I don't know) is pretty irrelevant on its own. We'll have to wait and see I suppose. | | | |
| John Terry Case on 13:07 - Jun 25 with 2618 views | padstow |
As I understand it, it makes no difference because Anton wasn't a witness anyway. He has openly said he didn't hear JT make the racist comments and has only seen what we have seen on TV. The witnesses are those who brought it to the attention of the police? Shirley?! | | | |
| John Terry Case on 13:10 - Jun 25 with 2605 views | QPR1882 |
John Terry racism trial legal team mull 'bad character' bid.
Hope to fck Anton don't try the same thing on terry, lawyers will take months searching. |  | | |
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| John Terry Case on 13:13 - Jun 25 with 2586 views | Jamie |
"This court finds Mr John George Terry not guilty of the racially aggravated public order offence as charged."
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| John Terry Case on 13:13 - Jun 25 with 2587 views | QPunkR |
| John Terry Case on 13:07 - Jun 25 by padstow |
As I understand it, it makes no difference because Anton wasn't a witness anyway. He has openly said he didn't hear JT make the racist comments and has only seen what we have seen on TV. The witnesses are those who brought it to the attention of the police? Shirley?! |
^^ This. Exactly this ^^
They can try what they like, but Anton had nothing to do with the claims and so it doesn't matter. John T*rry should duly be found guilty and will never play for Engerland ever again.
Just a shame he didn't shank a penalty onto the post last night as his last ever touch in an international game |  |
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| John Terry Case on 13:38 - Jun 25 with 2520 views | rcap |
He must be a witness, otherwise they wouldn't be considering a bad character application. Whether he's an important witness is a different matter - but Terry's team will have his witness statement and be able to decide on that. | | | |
| John Terry Case on 13:56 - Jun 25 with 2445 views | E17hoop |
| John Terry Case on 13:05 - Jun 25 by rcap |
Hmmm. Bad character is evidence of previous convictions, cautions or "misconduct" (normally investigated but non-prosecuted allegations), or of a disposition to do misconduct. But you can only get it in if it's important explanatory evidence, or if it's of substantial probative value to an important matter in issue.
The only use I can see for this is if there's something that Terry's legal team have that relates to Ferdinand's credibility - eg. that he's previously made unsubstantiated complaints. But there's been no media coverage of anything like that. The fact that Ferdinand has previously been in trouble with the police (if he has - I don't know) is pretty irrelevant on its own. We'll have to wait and see I suppose. |
It's probably to do with his arrest and prosecution for an assault charge and his arrest for no-attendance at court for a driving offence.
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| John Terry Case on 14:18 - Jun 25 with 2379 views | padstow |
| John Terry Case on 13:38 - Jun 25 by rcap |
He must be a witness, otherwise they wouldn't be considering a bad character application. Whether he's an important witness is a different matter - but Terry's team will have his witness statement and be able to decide on that. |
Fair enough then. They can take his witness statement that says "You know...I didn't...you know...see nuffink or...you know...hear nuffink...you know...Guv" and spend all their time discrediting him and trying to affect the credence the court should place on his ability to make such assertions.
I still don't think it changes much. Do you? really? | | | |
| John Terry Case on 14:20 - Jun 25 with 2371 views | Antti_Heinola |
| John Terry Case on 13:13 - Jun 25 by Jamie |
"This court finds Mr John George Terry not guilty of the racially aggravated public order offence as charged."
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He cannot win this case. The evidence is as clear as day. He does not have a leg with stocking pulled up over the knee to stand on. | |
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| John Terry Case on 14:26 - Jun 25 with 2345 views | RickyDicky |
| John Terry Case on 13:03 - Jun 25 by Toast_R |
Admirable consoling of Cole and Young yesterday. He's good at dealing with his team mates' misses... |
I think you spell that "Mrs" ! |  |
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| John Terry Case on 14:29 - Jun 25 with 2333 views | A40Bosh |
Was I seeing things, but post match last night I thought I even saw him kiss Ballotelli on the cheek.
Surely I imagined that?? |  |
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| John Terry Case on 14:30 - Jun 25 with 2325 views | Antti_Heinola |
| John Terry Case on 14:26 - Jun 25 by RickyDicky |
I think you spell that "Mrs" ! |
Nice one Ricky! :) | |
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| John Terry Case on 14:41 - Jun 25 with 2294 views | daveB |
he'll get off, his legal team will find every loophole going and get him cleared and then it will be down to the FA to do something | | | |
| John Terry Case on 15:13 - Jun 25 with 2245 views | themodfather |
| John Terry Case on 14:41 - Jun 25 by daveB |
he'll get off, his legal team will find every loophole going and get him cleared and then it will be down to the FA to do something |
desperate measures..they weren't going to stop "lip readers" then did try to block them in court, why?
they could clear him... | | | |
| John Terry Case on 15:49 - Jun 25 with 2189 views | rcap |
| John Terry Case on 14:18 - Jun 25 by padstow |
Fair enough then. They can take his witness statement that says "You know...I didn't...you know...see nuffink or...you know...hear nuffink...you know...Guv" and spend all their time discrediting him and trying to affect the credence the court should place on his ability to make such assertions.
I still don't think it changes much. Do you? really? |
Nah, I don't think it changes much. If it is just that Anton has previous re assault and driving charges, I can't imagine that the mags will let the bad character evidence in.
There are normally two situations where the bad character of non-defendant witnesses will be let in - where the defendant's defence is that the witness did it (so obviously eg. if the offence is theft, that the witness has previous theft convictions is relevant), or where the defendant's defence is that the witness is lying/exaggerating. If it's the latter, Anton's previous is only relevant if it concerns false testimony or false allegations. Otherwise, it shouldn't be allowed in - the defence doesn't get free-for-all on the prosecution witnesses for no benefit.
However, there is one complication. Since this is in the magistrates' court, the same judges who hear the application (to allow in the bad character evidence) will probably hear the trial EVEN IF they decide to exclude it. They're supposed to put it out of their mind, but obviously that's difficult. So the aim may be, by making the application, to plant a seed in the mags' minds that Anton's not all that clean either. Sneaky, but allowed. | | | |
| John Terry Case on 15:49 - Jun 25 with 2187 views | Juzzie |
The main witness is a TV camera, has that got 'previous' too?
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| John Terry Case on 22:14 - Jun 25 with 1957 views | derbyhoop |
I thought Terry was a scumbag. Then I heard his lawyer. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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