| Warburton, Stick or twist? 19:06 - Apr 2 with 75017 views | RangersDave |
Ok, so we arent doing as well as most of us thought we would.
However, we all know we should have had a new striker in during the last window, but didnt and this appears it might have been a mistake.
If form continues the way it is, Stoke etc will beat us, and we will be almost where we were last season......ergo no real improvement, and a squad thats fat, old, lazy, or comtractually obliged to play every game.
However, next season will need more players, as some will be leaving us, so who do you want to pick those players and next seasons formations?
So, do we keep Warburton (Stick) or do we get rid (twist)
I will start this........ Twist |  |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:25 - Apr 4 with 2779 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 09:18 - Apr 4 by TheChef |
Do you ever post on here when we win a game, or are doing well?
Fairly sure I've never seen you and stainrods_elbow in the same room. |
The usual ad hominem attacks on anyone who disagrees with happy clapper groupthink.  |  | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:29 - Apr 4 with 2747 views | daveB |
Oh Blimey I thought he signed a 3 year deal. He won't be here next year then unless we see an upturn in results pretty soon |  | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:31 - Apr 4 with 2731 views | TheChef |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:25 - Apr 4 by Wegerles_Stairs |
The usual ad hominem attacks on anyone who disagrees with happy clapper groupthink. |
By all means disagree, but like a few other posters you only seem to pop up to criticise when we're doing badly, and don't have anything positive to add when we're doing well. |  |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:34 - Apr 4 with 2706 views | Northernr |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:29 - Apr 4 by daveB |
Oh Blimey I thought he signed a 3 year deal. He won't be here next year then unless we see an upturn in results pretty soon |
Yes certainly seems it doesn't it? |  | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:37 - Apr 4 with 2685 views | daveB |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:34 - Apr 4 by Northernr |
Yes certainly seems it doesn't it? |
I'd give him another year but the season has been disappointing to be honest, even when we were winning we weren't playing that well.
A big summer ahead with so many players and a manager out of contract | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:39 - Apr 4 with 2660 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:31 - Apr 4 by TheChef |
By all means disagree, but like a few other posters you only seem to pop up to criticise when we're doing badly, and don't have anything positive to add when we're doing well. |
Nah, I've certainly posted when we've won, drawn and lost. My issue isn't with Warburton anyway - he's done a good job, even if I think the last couple of months have shown his shortcomings. It's more with those upstairs; we will only get somewhere when we have an owner like Benham who is committed and driven. Till then, it's regression. | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:44 - Apr 4 with 2617 views | WatfordR |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:34 - Apr 4 by Northernr |
Yes certainly seems it doesn't it? |
I had a concern after the Peterborough game that something didn't seem right amongst the players, and if they didn't show up for the remaining games, then MW would potentially have a problem.
I don't think I saw anything on Saturday to suggest the players weren't "right", thought they played ok. Take into account we have punched above our weight almost all season, we're bringing players through, the financial situation seems ok from a FFP point of view, I'm not sure I can understand why we wouldn't want that kind of stability to continue.
One thing that sticks in my mind from this stage last year was MW talking about incoming players adding real pace, and that never happened. If we are going to push on again next year, that absolutely must happen during the close season. |  | | |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:46 - Apr 4 with 2602 views | Rs_Holy |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:37 - Apr 4 by daveB |
I'd give him another year but the season has been disappointing to be honest, even when we were winning we weren't playing that well.
A big summer ahead with so many players and a manager out of contract |
Sorry to sound like a broken record but the season started fantastically (who remembers the pre-season friendly against ManUre?)... we were Sky Sports darlings early on because we were "free scoring QPR". We are suffering now because we don't have a big enough squad to compete with the other teams in and around the playoffs... (Its very similar at Blackburn and Coventry). We had 1 properly fit striker for several weeks until Dykes returned on Saturday.
We are operating within a strict budget, some clubs are gambling and for most of them it will fail and they may well go the same way as Derby. We need to stick with Warbs but also need a steady stream of youth teamers to make it into the first team squad and provide back up during a very long season. [Post edited 4 Apr 2022 10:49]
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:10 - Apr 4 with 2519 views | Sonofpugwash |
I just think tactically we've been rumbled and we haven't got the resources to change things.
A different path is needed both intellectually and physically.I can't see things improving with the current setup.
Reminds me somewhat of Gentleman Jim Magilton. |  |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:17 - Apr 4 with 2476 views | daveB |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:46 - Apr 4 by Rs_Holy |
Sorry to sound like a broken record but the season started fantastically (who remembers the pre-season friendly against ManUre?)... we were Sky Sports darlings early on because we were "free scoring QPR". We are suffering now because we don't have a big enough squad to compete with the other teams in and around the playoffs... (Its very similar at Blackburn and Coventry). We had 1 properly fit striker for several weeks until Dykes returned on Saturday.
We are operating within a strict budget, some clubs are gambling and for most of them it will fail and they may well go the same way as Derby. We need to stick with Warbs but also need a steady stream of youth teamers to make it into the first team squad and provide back up during a very long season. [Post edited 4 Apr 2022 10:49]
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I'm not for a second suggesting it's a bad season but I do think performance wise since we lost at Fulham it's not been great we've won a lot of games not playing well which has caught up with us a bit, to stay in the playoffs for so long is a massive positive and shows there is a real spirit at the club. I do think a major part of why it's gong wrong has been injuries meaning it's been chop and change a lot recently rather than a settled side.
A few red flags though in recent months. I thought Les mentioning that Warbs didn't want a striker wasn't intended to throw him under the bus but once things went wrong it's made it clear that was down to the manager rather than the club. Paul Halls recent interview with Clive seemed to smell a bit of the frustration of the under 23'd not breaking through this season, nothing major but these little things add up. | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:19 - Apr 4 with 2455 views | BAWHoops |
If his contract is up at the end of the season and we only manage 2 or 3 more wins before then, then I think they will shake hands and go separate ways.
You can't win just 4 or 5 games in 3.5 months and expect to be handed a new contract.
Will be really really sad to see him go |  |
| http://blogandwhitehoops.wordpress.com/ |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:26 - Apr 4 with 2429 views | BAWHoops |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:39 - Apr 4 by Wegerles_Stairs |
Nah, I've certainly posted when we've won, drawn and lost. My issue isn't with Warburton anyway - he's done a good job, even if I think the last couple of months have shown his shortcomings. It's more with those upstairs; we will only get somewhere when we have an owner like Benham who is committed and driven. Till then, it's regression. |
I disagree with that.
The current set up (Tony, Ruben taking a back seat with Les and Hoos running things) has seen us come down from the Prem and offload countless overpaid players.
It navigated a really tricky spell, kept us in the division and is now consistently buying and selling players at a profit whilst finishing each season with more points than the last.
Smithies, Furlong, Freeman, Eze, Manning all sold for more than what we paid for them after we developed them.
We also developed and sold Bright (who should've gone for more)
We have 3-4 players (Dieng, Dickie, Chair, Willock) who would fetch us upwards of 5m.
If we stay the course, keep developing and selling, keep improving our points total, then eventually we will go up and this time stay up with a proper foundation in place.
Also a spade in the ground on the training ground | |
| http://blogandwhitehoops.wordpress.com/ |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:31 - Apr 4 with 2404 views | Harbour |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:34 - Apr 4 by Northernr |
Yes certainly seems it doesn't it? |
Well if they let him go I really hope a suitable replacement is lined up I would assume this would be John Eustace.. Personally hope Warbs stays as despite results since end of January the ethos of the club the right signings and financial philosophy on style of play all very good. So why change? | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:37 - Apr 4 with 2363 views | ed_83 |
Stick with him, absurd to argue for anything else at this point. Even with our recent awful form we're still miles better off than we were when he took over, and as long as the squad are still working hard for him (which they are currently) and there are signs of recovery (which I'd argue there were against Fulham, despite the result) then he deserves the chance to pull us out of the slump, refresh the squad in the summer and go again.
Anyone unhappy with our current situation should take a step back and remember the continuous 16th-place finishes we we were treated to under Hasselbaink, McClaren, and Holloway, all while spending more on wages than we are now. Or think about WBA, who saw their playoff push faltering, changed their manager in an attempt to revitalise things, and got loads worse. We should be incredibly careful what we wish for.
But I think there needs to be a serious conversation in the summer about how Warburton's going to turn things around. I don't think he's the central reason we've been so shocking recently - we've got the second-highest average minutes per player in the league after Coventry, which means our best players have less in the tank, we're competing against teams with deeper pockets and stronger squads, and we've had a string of injuries in vital positions. But Warbs needs to show that he's got a plan for addressing all of that and keeping us progressing.
If we continue to play as poorly for the remainder of this season as we've done in the last two months - and particularly if we end up finishing lower than last year - then there needs to be a serious conversation within the club over the summer about where we're going, and whether Warburton's our best option for next season. But getting rid of him now? Absolutely no way. | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:51 - Apr 4 with 2299 views | ozexile |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 11:37 - Apr 4 by ed_83 |
Stick with him, absurd to argue for anything else at this point. Even with our recent awful form we're still miles better off than we were when he took over, and as long as the squad are still working hard for him (which they are currently) and there are signs of recovery (which I'd argue there were against Fulham, despite the result) then he deserves the chance to pull us out of the slump, refresh the squad in the summer and go again.
Anyone unhappy with our current situation should take a step back and remember the continuous 16th-place finishes we we were treated to under Hasselbaink, McClaren, and Holloway, all while spending more on wages than we are now. Or think about WBA, who saw their playoff push faltering, changed their manager in an attempt to revitalise things, and got loads worse. We should be incredibly careful what we wish for.
But I think there needs to be a serious conversation in the summer about how Warburton's going to turn things around. I don't think he's the central reason we've been so shocking recently - we've got the second-highest average minutes per player in the league after Coventry, which means our best players have less in the tank, we're competing against teams with deeper pockets and stronger squads, and we've had a string of injuries in vital positions. But Warbs needs to show that he's got a plan for addressing all of that and keeping us progressing.
If we continue to play as poorly for the remainder of this season as we've done in the last two months - and particularly if we end up finishing lower than last year - then there needs to be a serious conversation within the club over the summer about where we're going, and whether Warburton's our best option for next season. But getting rid of him now? Absolutely no way. |
One thing I haven't seen really mentioned is whether he wants to stay on. I reckon he'll pull the pin. The squad needs a massive overhaul yet again and I'm not sure he's got the energy or enthusiasm for it. | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:19 - Apr 4 with 2194 views | RangersDave |
Well i've really started something here, havnt i?
I didnt mean it to get so divisive and in some places abusive towards me. And as such i'm sorry i did start it.
Let me try and explain where i am coming from a little better.
Do i want to see Warburton go? no, i do not
Do i want to see him stay? yes......but........ he has to change, tippy tappy triangular 'toberlone' footy is all pretty and keeps up the possession average for the stat boys out there, but it has been found out, and found out well by the teams we have played the last few months.
Can or will Warbs change is another matter. he has shown he cannot, and his unwillingess to try a fast pressing game , when we see it does work is strange.
Maybe he hasnt got the players to do that? maybe they are all injured? but.....we are where we are so why not 'blood' a youngster or 2, and give them the experience? Maybe not for a couple of more matches but after then if we are still in a slump?
Now, you have to ask why the situation with the 2 newbies playing instead of better players on the bench. We can only think that a) either Warbs rates them higher than his current players, or B) He's been told to play them. I dont know which to be fair.
Either way, we are not seeing the 'old rangers' from before 3 months ago, or dare i say it post Christmas. And i'm seeing a worrying trend on losing and not playing to our strengths..... maybe we dont have strengths at the moment.
Yes, i know we have financial constraints, and the guys there are working admirably to them, but why oh why are we paying benchwarmers we wont use, or developing players only to not use them in the first team? If they aint good enough, get rid.........if they are, then someone remind me of how old Michael Owen was when he made his England debut? Nah, dont...i know it, it was 18! Do we not have any youngsters like this in our teams?
So, here we are, we have done ok, if mid table at the end of the season is ok .......again! Do you honestly think that Warbs can push on, if so where's the money coming from to get 5-7 new players for next season? And do you think Wabs has the 'nouse' to be able to drop warbs ball and try something new?
At the moment we are slowly sliding to mid table mediocrity again, and dont tell me thats good. Last year we finished 9th, the year before 13th and before that 19th, so not much of an improvement under Warbs, and in fact it could end the season lower than 9th.
Mid table is fine, dont get me wrong..... it's safe, secure etc etc.......but its not progress (yes you can argue injuries, bad refs, not buying a striker when we had the opportunity, getting 2 donkeys in), and will continue not to be if we carry on with this style of football.
This worrys me, along with the warnings that Warbs is not a man to change or push on that came with him as over weight baggage when he came to Cassa Rangers.
Maybe his team selection, formation intransigence etc wil be his undoing, and i bet that having seen us 'ooop top' fighting for promotion the owners will have started to think 'maybe at last we can possibly look forward to a return on our investment'?
So, i will still be wrong in your eyes, but please try and understand where i'm coming from with this...... Warbs to me, is a man of his day, and that day has passed. And again, i agree, who do you replace him with? There are candidates out there, but maybe not the best, or young blood that needs a chance higher up? i dont know..... and there's the rub.
However, i'm still going with Twist, as i cannot see Warbs turning things around, but i do sincerely hope i am repentant in, say, 5 matches time when we are firmly in the playoffs. If we are, i'll come here and eat humble pie, i promise.
Cheers
Dave | |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:20 - Apr 4 with 2190 views | BlackCrowe |
100% stick.
Up until the beginning of February, he's given me the best few months of Rs supporting since the Warnock years. Because of that he's inadvertedly created a platform over ridiculous expectation and entitlement from a section of our fanbase. Very depressing. |  |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:23 - Apr 4 with 2186 views | TacticalR |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 10:29 - Apr 4 by daveB |
Oh Blimey I thought he signed a 3 year deal. He won't be here next year then unless we see an upturn in results pretty soon |
I don't think any decision should be made on the basis of the rest of this season's results.
I thought after the Peteborough game when it was announced that Willock was out for the rest of the season that with all the injuries and off-form players we needed to forget about the play-offs and plan for next season. |  |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:25 - Apr 4 with 2177 views | timeforheroes |
Assess in 7 games time, if we don't win at least 2 of those I would expect him to go but maybe the players will pull out some performances for him if his comments to WLS are true. If he does would like us to go for Karl Robinson (provided Oxford don't come up), been linked last few times we've had a vacancy but got Oxford playing some nice stuff and their model appears to be what we say we're going for. [Post edited 4 Apr 2022 12:26]
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:48 - Apr 4 with 2091 views | DieByYourSide |
Interesting timing.
Gives Warburton effectively 7 games to re-interview for his job, show he's still got the mettle and hunger for it and can get a tune out of this (depleted) group. Much as people claim they'd have bitten your hand off to even be in with a shout of the playoffs...the playoffs was the remit. If we don't get that, then the season has ultimately been a failure - couple that with the alarming drop off in form/ideas/some very concerning performances and you can see why we might make a change.
This revelation about his contract changes things, it's no longer sacking him but just changing course.
Could see an argument for Eustace - the succession option, already known to the players but can freshen things up, clearly rated and possibly given assurances he might get the main job given he turned down Swansea in the Summer.
Then there are names like Jokanovic, Farke, Wagner all with proven promotion pedigree, but are we an attractive enough proposition for them, could we put together the financial package for them and transfers? Maybe given we already have the nucleus of a good squad but names like these would be pushing the boat out a bit more.
Or of course Warburton could use this to rally himself and the players, put together some results and get us into the Top 6 - unlikely but still not impossible. [Post edited 4 Apr 2022 12:49]
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:59 - Apr 4 with 2047 views | TacticalR |
Of course getting into the top 6 is possible, but is it likely? We are currently bottom of the Championship form table. | |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 13:57 - Apr 4 with 1864 views | daveB |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:23 - Apr 4 by TacticalR |
I don't think any decision should be made on the basis of the rest of this season's results.
I thought after the Peteborough game when it was announced that Willock was out for the rest of the season that with all the injuries and off-form players we needed to forget about the play-offs and plan for next season. |
They have to have an impact though, we've lost 5 out of the last 6, 2 wins in the last 12. if that continues I can't see them offering him a new deal | | | |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 14:04 - Apr 4 with 1836 views | TheChef |
| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 12:48 - Apr 4 by DieByYourSide |
Interesting timing.
Gives Warburton effectively 7 games to re-interview for his job, show he's still got the mettle and hunger for it and can get a tune out of this (depleted) group. Much as people claim they'd have bitten your hand off to even be in with a shout of the playoffs...the playoffs was the remit. If we don't get that, then the season has ultimately been a failure - couple that with the alarming drop off in form/ideas/some very concerning performances and you can see why we might make a change.
This revelation about his contract changes things, it's no longer sacking him but just changing course.
Could see an argument for Eustace - the succession option, already known to the players but can freshen things up, clearly rated and possibly given assurances he might get the main job given he turned down Swansea in the Summer.
Then there are names like Jokanovic, Farke, Wagner all with proven promotion pedigree, but are we an attractive enough proposition for them, could we put together the financial package for them and transfers? Maybe given we already have the nucleus of a good squad but names like these would be pushing the boat out a bit more.
Or of course Warburton could use this to rally himself and the players, put together some results and get us into the Top 6 - unlikely but still not impossible. [Post edited 4 Apr 2022 12:49]
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Was playoffs the remit though?
I'd have thought it would be to improve on 9th place from last season (and if that is Top 6, then great). | |
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| Warburton, Stick or twist? on 14:12 - Apr 4 with 1804 views | johncharles |
I’ve noticed a lot of the “Warburton to be sacked etc.” stories are coming from Yorkshire Live. Our next game is against Sheffield Utd which is in …….. Yorkshire |  |
| Strong and stable my arse. |
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