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Well that seemed a reasonable assessment to me. Well done - you must be an accountant (but i won't hold that aginst you!). Given all that, I'll just go an put a fresh pair of Y fronts on then.
Btw do you know when the current shirt sponsorship deal ends, as I would expect a much more lucrative deal for the club when this next comes up for grabs?
If only things were so straight forward I'm sure Pompey wouldn't have got themselves into a mess.
Was there a brought forward position at all? If you are going to bring in last year's tv money at least?
Short and longer term working capital cost?
Your stadium looks neglgible to run. Is it all that plastic?
No relationship with the family trust overseeing it all? They must be altruistic in the extreme if all that capital is tied up earning them nothing.
Cortese and his team seem oafully cheap too.
You can't cover it simply by saying the operating costs are covered by day to day profits and then take all the income and set it against the bigger costs you have mentioned.
You should indeed go into accounting.....I can think of some Russians and a Nepalese who might make use of you.
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 15:01 - Aug 20 with 5376 views
No "brought forward position". Irrelevant anyway as P&L flows into Balance Sheet. I am discussing a cash-flow over two seasons.
Working capital: Irrelevant. The club was purchased and debts cleared through equity.
Stadiums costs are negligible compared to player wages and as mentioned I have deliberately hypothecated all merchandise, sponsorship, hospitality and match-day food income for this purpose. Any shortfall would most certainly be negligible as a rounding error against season turnover of circa £80 million.
Family Trust is a total red herring. Utterly irrelevant. Once again, this is a cash-flow forecast of a long term investment. The Trust/ML put in a total of £50 million. The balance sheet present value of the club holding its own in the PL will represent a colossal gain on the initial investment. Even an idiot can see that.
You clearly have not read correctly. I specifically have NOT included beer/pies/sponsorship/merchandise in the income statements against the 'bigger costs'. You fail here.
I need absolutely no lecturing on dodgy accounting from jealous skates like you. None of your criticisms about my original post hold water. If you can't get your head around premier league numbers don't try.
I guess if we do have a cup run then as you say we will get some extra cash. Not least of that would be payment from the TV company that covers it. So far you took into account Sky money only. I seem to remember being a live game in the FA Cup for example being worth up to half a mill ?
That makes me think, do we get the same amount of Sky money regardless of how many times we are on? So IF we are doing well and they decide to televise more later in the season would we get more money?
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 19:11 - Aug 20 with 5184 views
Number of appearances does affect pay-out from Sky, yes. On the old terms 25% of the Sky money was based on the number of televised games (50% being an equal amount for all teams and 25% based on final league position).
I assume the percentages remain the same under the new deal. If so, Saints may well benefit from being one of the more watchable sides in the league and a potential banana skin for the top 6 sides.
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 19:24 - Aug 20 with 5168 views
I would suggest that many of the assumptions and the overall logic to be correct, though I would argue that the wages have indeed been underestimated.
For instance, I expect Ramirez and Osvaldo are earning slightly more than 50k p/w and that others (Lovren and perhaps Wanyama) may not be miles behind that figure.
Similarly Lallana, Lambert and Schneiderlin are closer to 40k pw in all reality.
I just looked on FM (far from accurate but usually ballpark) and it has Mayuka as the only squad member earning sub 15k with many in the mid 20's and compared to other wage figures in the league this seems reasonable.
However, Saints wages are still far more in control than those of Portsmouth and QPR were/are and I believe we have been moving to an approach that uses bonuses as an increasing part of the set up.
I do believe there will be a deficit, as there was in all seasons under Cortese and that the long term plan has to be to increase stadium capacity towards 40,000 and significantly improve sponsorship and marketing revenues.
If most of the current players progress as hoped and the academy continues to be productive than It's likely that the last two summers heavy expenditure need not often be repeated either........most of our squad is young, of sufficient quality and improving.
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 19:27 - Aug 20 with 5166 views
You're living up to your name there, Iceberg yoU clearly have hidden depths and have shown up our resident PortsMyth local gov officer as the small minded lemon he is. Well done!
maybe some are higher, but I would be amazed if the younguns are on anything even approaching 15k.
Then there is the possibility of loaning players out - like Puncheon to Palace - who will then either in whole or in part be off the wage bill for the season.
Still reckon circa £45 million per annum is a top-end for wages all told for the whole squad.
I don't think it's far off either, and agree that Chambers, Isgrove and Gazza are probably all sub 15k.
Shaw's new contract is likely higher as it is estimated that Fox is on something like 20k pw (there was a rumour he was the highest paid player when we originally signed him) so it would likely exceed that.
It's right to focus on wages though- people see the big transfer fees and get worried but keeping the wages in line with the figures you suggested is the surest way to stay stable.
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 23:50 - Aug 20 with 5021 views
Here we go. The font of all knowledge has arrived to tell us just where SFC is royally screwing up at every turn and how the owners have pulled the rug. Or not.
You spend all day chugging round in circles dredging up shit, getting more and more stressed about us. It's not healthy. As distasteful as it is, why not stick to you own forums wishing career threatening injuries on our players. It's more your level.
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 06:54 - Aug 21 with 4975 views
1. Catering is outsourced to a company (Owned by our Chairman no less I believe) so the club only get a proportion of profit, so im not sure all our costs would be fully covered by this and sponsorship
2. Wage bill is a reasonable assumption, although you are forgetting to add on pension contributions of around another 10%, also its rumoured that Ramirez wages are net, if so could be a lot higher .
3. You haven't included those players not in the squad, Sharp, Hammond, Bernard and a few others would be on significant wages, some of which would be covered when out on loan, what wouldn't be covered though is there annual loyalty bonus
3. You haven't included costs such as signing on fee's, league position bonus's and loyalty bonus's which can be quite significant, even at £100k each per player per year (probably more Ramirez would not be cheap) that's an extra £2.5 million.
4. What about the £1.5 million salary to our ceo
All in all add on these "extras and that £7.5 million deficit could be easily doubled
Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime
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The Finances of the Club - How we CAN afford the new players on 11:05 - Aug 21 with 4866 views
Rumour has it after the Gulf War he went into hiding only to reappear many years later posting under various names on Pompey message boards. He is believed to be responsible for discrediting the attack and subsequent retreat of the Pompey firm at the infamous battle of The Joiners in 2003. Saints fans he commented "retreated like rats PMSL LOL".
yes, sure but I would still be amazed if the wage bill is materially higher than £45 million. Also I believe I may have overstated the NI contributions.
Do you have any evidence that footballers get a 10% employer contribution to their pension? I would be surprised to say the least. For non-football staff this would be a rounding error on a rounding error.
As for the catering, the outsourcing would only have been done because it would yield maximum profitability versus cost. In other words it won't matter who does it, the club will have chosen to maximise profits. I stand by my ball-park that the profits from the combination of merchandise, sponsorship (£1m per year aap + others) and corporate hosp are in the ball park of what the day-to-day costs of the club are. Any discrepancy would again not be significantly material against the Big Expenses.
My numbers represent a first approximation to determine if there are any gapping holes in the club's finances or projection. +/- £10m is not an issue. It is also worth pointing out that big transfer fees are rarely paid in one instalment - I would reckon that Osvaldo is maybe £5m per year for three years. That makes the annual cash-flow I laid out above much better. Or if they are all paid in one lot then it means next season there will be a shed load of positive cash flow.
Either way, I have shown that the club is not over reaching, the numbers are fine and there is nothing to worry about.
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