| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men 17:50 - Jun 29 with 45328 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
Truly awful. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 15:23 - Jul 1 with 1285 views | londonlisa2001 |
Having the correct prison population leads to less crime.
If you and a criminal were both jailed we’d have less crime than we have now. If you were then both let out we’d have more crime. Neither one of those factual statements means it’s the right thing to do.
There are lots of people in prison that shouldn’t be there. It’s dangerous and lazy to put them there because we can’t be bothered to invest in the things that would be a far better alternative. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 15:39 - Jul 1 with 1260 views | Lohengrin |
Ah! right, strategic bombing. That’s what you think Omagh was? And you don’t see any problem with a ‘British’ politician offering succour to those engaged in murdering her fellow citizens out shopping on a Saturday morning then?
What about Reading, was that a ‘strategic stabbing? Or Ken Bigley, was his a ‘strategic’ beheading? | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 15:46 - Jul 1 with 1247 views | Highjack |
When you say shouldn’t be there do you mean wrongly convicted or they should be getting a different punishment? | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 15:54 - Jul 1 with 1239 views | A_Fans_Dad |
So, you do not believe in protecting the public?
Career criminals just laugh at the courts, they leave on bail and go straight back to committing the same crimes.
Watch day time TV real life police programmes, the amount of work they have to do to satisfy the CPS is totally undone by weak or non existent sentencing.
The criminlas just laugh at the courts and us.
And it is not just here, Australia have exactly the same problem. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 15:56 - Jul 1 with 1238 views | Highjack |
It’s because we have a never ending conveyor belt of scumbaggery. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:03 - Jul 1 with 1230 views | londonlisa2001 |
Different punishment. And punishment isn’t always the correct word either.
(I assume that although there are wrongful convictions, they are a small percentage. Every country has them, I don’t think our rates of wrongful conviction are particularly high compared to elsewhere).
We have a lot of people disappearing into prison for minor offences and coming out far more dangerous to society than they were when they went in. Plus having been to prison, their life chances are shot to shit which means they’re far more likely to offend in the future.
Prison is an incredibly stupid way of dealing with many crimes. The US is a vast experiment which shows where this track leads, and it’s awful. Ever increasing prison population and ever increasing crime. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:10 - Jul 1 with 1224 views | A_Fans_Dad |
Would you care to list for us which crimes you think should include jail time and which shouldn't and what the alternative is? | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:11 - Jul 1 with 1221 views | Drizzy |
The IRA's bombing campaign had a political purpose, whether you agree with it or not. The actions of the splinter group came about 10 years after Dianne Abbott made those comments.
Not sure what Reading or Ken Bigley have to do with this discussion but let's not dredge up the British army's actions in the Middle East. It'll spoil your fantasy and I don't have it in me to read about dead Iraqi children. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:12 - Jul 1 with 1219 views | Drizzy |
Ah right, we're uniquely scummy compared to the rest of Europe. Explains Brexit, at least. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:15 - Jul 1 with 1215 views | Jango |
Graph 1 is knife crime over time. Graph 2 is stop and search over time. You don't need to do a robust analysis to see there's no correlation between them.
That’s what you put. We were talking about overall stop and search, no mention whatsoever about S.60 until I picked you up on it. Don’t criticise people about graphs when you don’t even undersstand the graph youre posting about. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:23 - Jul 1 with 1211 views | Drizzy |
Section 60 is the one designed for knife crime as it's the only one that doesn't require probable cause and it was specifically introduced for knife crime. Note that the trend is the same for section 60 as it is all stop and search:
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/crime-justice-and-the-law/pol
I didn't even stratify by ethnicity but I will now, when black people were being searched at an unbelievably high rate it still had no impact on the knife crime numbers.
Still no evidence of a correlation between stop and search and a reduction in knife crime. None. Just more handwringing and misunderstanding.
We're never going to agree but I hope, at the very least, you've learned how to read a graph. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:24 - Jul 1 with 1210 views | londonlisa2001 |
I think drugs possession offences should be nowhere near prison for starters.
In 2016/17 (just used as I happen to have the breakdown) over a thousand people were put in prison for drug possession. Not supply, possession.
Theft is another one. Most common reason for people to be in prison. Some thefts (theft from the home, particularly at night) fair enough. But theft from shops? 12,800 people sent to prison for that in 2016. The vast majority of theft convictions are repeat offenders. So the way we are handling it isn’t working. Fraud cases - over 2000 custodial sentences.
This is crazy stuff. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:26 - Jul 1 with 1208 views | Lohengrin |
At the time she published her support the violence in Ulster and beyond was off the scale. There’s no doubt whatsoever that what she, Corbyn et al were up to amounted to treason, unquestionably.
In 1984 the penalty was death by hanging. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:35 - Jul 1 with 1197 views | Drizzy |
Ah, right. You think Dianne Abbott should have hanged for things she wrote in a newspaper?
Go and tell a random person, Loh. Anyone not a regular of the Legion. Let us all know how that goes. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 16:54 - Jul 1 with 1181 views | Jango |
We were talking about the country as a whole. You’ve put 2 graphs up with no mention on the Met Police or Section 60. You were either deliberately trying to be dishonest, which we all know you’ve done before now, or you just weren’t aware of the details of the graph you were using.
You also said this earlier.
Stop and search is evaluated for knife crime, not for catching non-violent drug offenders. Stop and search had little to no effect on reducing knife crime, which is its aim.
A small number of forces conduct most stop and searches. The Metropolitan Police Service (MPS) conducted almost half of all searches in 2018/19 (48%). 64% of all searches were conducted by just five forces: the MPS, Merseyside, West Midlands, South Wales and West Yorkshire.
Most searches are conducted to find drugs. Around 60% of all reasonable grounds searches were conducted to find drugs in 2018/19 with around 15% conducted to find offensive weapons.
Wrong again.
Another fact you won’t like to read.
Stop and search is more effective at detecting criminals. Around a fifth of all searches (22%) in 2018/19 resulted in a criminal justice outcome (an arrest or out of court disposal) linked to the purpose of the search. It is estimated that 8% of all 2018/19 arrests were generated by a stop and search encounter. [Post edited 1 Jul 2020 16:55]
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 17:14 - Jul 1 with 1161 views | Lohengrin |
The circle she moved on the periphery of were up to far more than publishing badly written pieces in a rag that only other loonies read. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 17:25 - Jul 1 with 1151 views | Drizzy |
Section 60 is the most relevant to the discussion about knife crime as I've said before. You're only highlighting my lack of clarification, not that the trend is any different. There's still no correlation.
We've had this entire discussion, and previous discussions, about knife crime where you've pivoted between various different ill-conceived arguments.
First, before seeing any of the data I posted, you said it's OK for black people to get searched more as they commit more crime. They're arrested at 3x the rate, they were searched at 10x the rate. What a ridiculous statement that was, shame the thread was deleted.
Then, stop and search was an effective deterrent. Fullfact had an entire section dedicated to this which debunked this myth, in fact the first line of that section read:
"The evidence on stop and search suggests it is not a particularly good deterrent."
After that you tried claiming the graphs showed some correlation between stop and search and knife crime. It didn't. You looked at two points from 2014 to now and then said it was rising, neglecting to see it was only rising to levels seen in 2011. Ironically right after the peak of stop and search.
Now you're shifting to drug possession because you've exhausted all the wrong arguments about knife crime. Let's evaluate stop & search and see if it had any impact on drug use, I've got some figures for young people's drug consumption, working on the assumption that organised crime supply met the demand.
Consumption of the big three looks pretty steady to me. Similar % of young people consuming, similar amounts of money funding organised crime. Seems like stop and searches defining legacy was overcrowding prisons with non-violent drug offenders. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:12 - Jul 1 with 1112 views | Jango |
We’re talking about about stop and search. You decided to use the graphs from the MPS. I’ve had a read through and found a number of stats and info that totally contradicts what you’ve been mumbling on about. Rather than answer those though you’ve found more nonsense statistics that mean nothing. Possession of drugs is a crime, if you’re caught in possession you get arrested, it’s as simple as that.
You keep on about the 10x the rate searched, that’s a national statistic yet you always fail to mention that around 50% of all stop and searches are in London, where not only do black peoples disproportionately commit the crimes but it’s an area where there’s a massive gang problem. Hang around in gangs in an area where there is a massive knife and gang problem and expect to be searched. If you haven’t got a knife and be respectful there’ll be no problem. People like you criticising police instead of drilling that into these youths is part of the problem.
Stop and search is more effective at detecting criminals. Around a fifth of all searches (22%) in 2018/19 resulted in a criminal justice outcome (an arrest or out of court disposal) linked to the purpose of the search. It is estimated that 8% of all 2018/19 arrests were generated by a stop and search encounter.
You chose to ignore this because it doesn’t match what your little pictures and chosen graphs. Police officers actually say stop and search helps them do their job but Drizzy disagrees because certain graphs say so .
You also said this earlier.
Stop and search is evaluated for knife crime, not for catching non-violent drug offenders. Stop and search had little to no effect on reducing knife crime, which is its aim.
I proved this was bullshit, you ignored it. [Post edited 1 Jul 2020 18:24]
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:20 - Jul 1 with 1103 views | Highjack |
Well we have our own fair share of scumbags but we also actively import lots of other peoples scumbags and have been for the last two decades, leading to an overload of scumbaggery. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:35 - Jul 1 with 1088 views | londonlisa2001 |
“Possession of drugs is a crime, if you’re caught in possession you get arrested, it’s as simple as that.“
Actually it’s not as simple as that. It’s one of the reasons why stop and search is so hated amongst the black community, as arrests for drug possession amongst black kids are totally out of kilter with arrests for possession amongst white kids despite white kids being as likely (It’s actually slightly more likely I believe) to be recreational drug users. That gives black kids a criminal record and scuppers their futures which doesn’t happen with their white counterparts.
What they should do is use stop and search properly - it’s fine to use it for knife crime for example, but if they find drugs for personal use on a kid they’ve stopped for reasons of knife crime, or gun crime or similar, they should just let them go. If they did that they’d be far more supported in the community. And trust would instantly improve. Which would help in more serious crimes.
If you have ten white kids and ten black kids, 5 of each use recreational drugs but are not otherwise criminal, and due to stop and search, 7 of the black kids get stopped and 1 of the white kids, the black kids will end up being totally disproportionately targeted for recreational drug use. They’ll end up with worse lives for ever as a result of their skin colour being the same as knife wielding scum bags.
Surely you can see that’s unfair? Yes, even though drug use is illegal blah blah - the PM has admitted to cocaine use so let’s shelve the nonsense. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:53 - Jul 1 with 1073 views | Drizzy |
You've proved absolutely f*ck all. I said stop and search was evaluated for its effectiveness on knife crime, and that was the justification for bringing it back.
Here's Boris Johnson, a few months ago, in his first address to the Commons as Prime Minister. Mentioned earlier, but I'll repeat it:
"We reduced knife crime in London with a very active policy of stop and search. I know Labour Members opposed that, but they were wrong, and we took thousands of knives–11,000 knives–off the streets of London. We saved lives across the city, and my hon. Friend can be proud of what he did to help that campaign."
He lied. Shock. It didn't reduce knife crime at all. He's also evaluating stop and search for its effectiveness in tackling knife crime which is exactly what I said. Painful lack of comprehension.
"50% of all stop and searches are in London, where not only do black peoples disproportionately commit the crimes but it’s an area where there’s a massive gang problem."
The stop and search rate is for black kids in London is 13x the average, were they committing crimes at 13x the rate of others in London? Give over. You're talking absolute bollocks.
You keep quoting the criminal justice outcomes being successful. Your definition of success is finding an unspecified amount of drugs. How does that do anything to stop organised drug networks? The bottom-up approach does absolutely f*ck all because there's another young kid waiting ready to be a runner. Not to mention not every one charged with drug possession is a dealer.
You're a purveyor of useless, backwards, ill-informed thinking that does nothing to solve the wider problem of crime. Stop and searches' greatest legacy was the criminalisation of young black children, lumbered with a criminal record or lobbed without care into the prison system. It did absolutely f*ck all to knife crime and the drugs trade. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:53 - Jul 1 with 1073 views | A_Fans_Dad |
The point that is missed about stop & search is that to be a deterrent it needs a decent sentence.
Do you know what average sentence is for carrying a Weapon in the UK?
17 Months and that is without "good behavour" being taken in to consideration.
What gangbanger wouldn't take the chance of getting caught and if he did it would just increase his "street cred", because that is what gangs are all about. | | | |
| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 18:58 - Jul 1 with 1065 views | Drizzy |
EU 2004 Citizenship directive stops freedom of movement for serious offenders.
Where's the evidence that we import more scumbags from the EU than any other country?
If you're talking about asylum seekers, we have one of the smallest rates of intake of any country. Why isn't Germany or Austria's crime rate so much higher if they're importing so many potential scumbags?
You really don't have a single shred of evidence to support anything you say. Truly frightening. [Post edited 1 Jul 2020 18:59]
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 19:18 - Jul 1 with 1044 views | Darran |
Drizz go out and get some snatch mun. | |
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| Notorious Racist Priyamvada Gopal Has Urges to Kneecap White Men on 19:22 - Jul 1 with 1039 views | A_Fans_Dad |
That is just about what I would expect from a bleeding heart liberal.
You don't see drug possession as a prisonable offence.
Well let's look at that a bit closer shall we. If there was no market there would be no drug dealers, call me an idealistic fool, but it is a fact.
Drug taking, especially addiction leads to all kinds of crime when the users can no longer afford to finance their habit. It leads to prostitution for both sexes, which I would have thought you would be dead against. It also leads to gang culture and gang warfare.
You at least differentiate between theft (burglary) of homes which traumatises the victims and common theft. But even there we have a problem, losses from theft can wipe out a small shop's profits and see them go under. It can lead to violent theft as in armed robbery. However even if it is big shops it leads to more expensive goods for everyone else to pay, you may be prepared to share the increased cost of the goods and insurance but I am not.
Then the pièce de résistance of Fraud, you obviously see no problem with scammers diddling little old ladies, or men out of their life savings do you?
Or putting workers out of their jobs when Companies take big hits, there are no victimless crimes. Somebody ends up paying the price, except of course with your ideas the people who perpertrate the crimes. [Post edited 1 Jul 2020 23:26]
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