| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 12:18 - Feb 22 with 2076 views | BarrySwan |
Stop treating addicts as victims.
They're responsible for the whole mess...... no demand...no illegal drugs industry.
I'm also fed up of addicts whining about more non existent funds not being spent on rehabilitation for their own addictions.
All the while decent people are dying because of lack of funding for consultants and vital life saving operations because of money wasted on parasitic addicts.. | | |  |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 12:26 - Feb 22 with 2049 views | perchrockjack |
Barry.
People do not have a choice to have cancer, strokes, dementia but do have regarding drug use
It's human weakness ,fraility and we need to prioritise .
The Portuguese laws amendment is in no way a panacea . There are still significant issues there . Users have to attend centres ,same as here | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 14:32 - Feb 22 with 2023 views | Drizzy |
Some terribly archaic views lacking any human compassion in this thread. Is anyone shocked to see main purveyor being that bloke from the Wirral?
Addicts are not to blame for cyclical poverty trapping them in hopeless situations where the only momentary relief is a ruthlessly addictive substance like heroin. The circumstances that lead them there are out of their control.
Decriminalisation is the first step to reducing harm associated with drug use but the problem will persist so long as poverty exists. That doesn't render decriminalisation any less necessary though.
Reading some of the opinions on this thread is just sad. So many people lacking any empathy. I suppose that's the byproduct of conceit and a career with a state issued truncheon. [Post edited 22 Feb 2018 14:39]
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 14:40 - Feb 22 with 2008 views | Darran |
No I’m not surprised,he’s got archaic views on just about everything including historic child molestors,historic sex abusers,women and skin colour. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 15:31 - Feb 22 with 1981 views | BarrySwan |
Lacking compassion and empathy?
I see.
You mean not appreciating the contribution to society made by the many drug addicts breaking into our houses in their desperate search for funds for their next fix so that victims feel that their own homes have been violated and everybodies limited income gets stretched even further by rises in insurance policies
Or the many drug addicts committing street crime such as muggings or great volumes of shoplifting to feed their habit which creates unsafe streets and puts prices up in the shops we all use.
Or the drug addled unemployables that turn up every fortnight to claim the dole money handed out to them which has been raised by decent hard working people to help those temporarily out of work due to factory or office closures to survive whilst they look for new work.
Not for those who are so drug addled that their only contribution to society is to drain and syphon off as much as they can in the knowledge that no employer would touch them with a bargepole.
Or the whining moaning drug addicts who drain NHS resources whilst the rest of the population can't get a doctors appointment for weeks, consultant appointments or operations for months or even years and then have to listen to drug addicts complaining bitterly that that the rest who do contribute the funding for all these services aren't pumping in even more for the rehabilitation that many of them waste and abuse anyway.
Or the drug addicts that the rest have to pay for their methadone every day whilst struggling to feed a family. Why on earth I am I forced against my will to fund a drug addicts drug habit of daily heroin substitute at the local chemist?
Most of us have been in impoverished circumstances now and again possibly wondering how to pay the next bill but somehow miraculously managing to avoid becoming a drug addict draining the resourses of other hard working people
Well how inconsiderate of us all who don't hold the same view of yourself that we should be funding others drug habits and the results of their addictions.
You're quite welcome to donate as much as you like of your own resources if you wish but others including myself object to the forced use of our taxes to do the same. [Post edited 22 Feb 2018 22:57]
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 15:59 - Feb 22 with 1932 views | perchrockjack |
Drizzly. Our very own Albert Schewietzer .
Or a living example of just what massive hypocrites we are .
Here s a few facts
Nobody needs to shoot up heroin. Millions die as an da ple. So why do it
Nobody needs to smoke weed .some of us even managed to get through the sixties without dope . I seemed to enjoy life without .
To even suggest drugs is an option to escape reality of " poverty" just about insults all working class families throughout previous generations that had a far shittier life than these days and had no time to score as they were basically fooked after working 12/14 hour days .
Drizzly ,that bloke from God Knows where ...pitiful
Finally....me ol cocks....no demand ,no drug dealers ,no business .
As long as tossers are willing to try ,drug dealers will prosper and legalising will not change anything
Bloke from Wirral | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 16:23 - Feb 22 with 1915 views | lifelong |
At what age would the pro legalise drug people recommend that our young people could legally inject heroin into their veins? | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 16:45 - Feb 22 with 1923 views | Shonky |
Treat the problem rather than the symptom.
Deal with the underlying factors of the addiction and the effects go away.
I didn't choose to be an alcoholic. By the time I knew I was one I couldn't stop.
I sought help and treated the issues that led to my dependence on alcohol. I haven had a drink in a decade.
There is a way out of that cycle. [Post edited 22 Feb 2018 16:48]
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:06 - Feb 22 with 1911 views | Drizzy |
You mention several scenarios in which drug users commit crimes to "feed their habits" what solution do you propose? Being in support of rehabilitation doesn't excuse a crime, it's the most logical response to a problem driven by the acute effects of addiction.
You seem obsessed with the apparent costs of drug addicts on society, blaming them for rising insurance premiums and even higher prices in shops. Fair play that's one spectacular stretch. The most economically beneficial way is to have drug users become productive members of society. They're not going to that in prison they're going to become an even greater burden to the taxpayer.
In terms of drain on NHS resources, the absolute number of drug addicts remains relatively tiny compared to the vast swathes of obese smokers and drinkers who will cost you far more overall.
There's also empirical evidence to support the theory that rehabilitation is the most successful way of helping both users and society by reducing harm to themselves and others (crime). Here's part of an abstract from one such study of the Swiss heroin prescription method:
"Results suggest that heroin prescription causes a strong & stable decrease in the criminal involvement of most patients. Similar patterns of resistance are observed for a broad range of offences & across different subpopulations of patients. Although the most pronounced decrease in criminal involvement is observed in the group of those treated permanently, treatment effects seem to hold in the post-treatment period."
Drug addicts are going to cost you money, it's just a case of whether you'd rather it go to rehabilitation, treatment and support or to policing and imprisonment. If it's the latter then do I have to ask where you've been for the last 40 years because it's an utterly failed strategy. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:07 - Feb 22 with 1909 views | Drizzy |
Considering its illegality hasn't stopped kids around 12 years old from injecting it, I would answer by saying it's a totally irrelevant question. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:23 - Feb 22 with 1903 views | Drizzy |
The fact you mention heroin and weed in a similar vein shows how remarkably out of touch you are.
"Nobody needs to shoot up heroin."
No but they do. But rather than sit around and pontificate over the thought processes of individuals we don't know, why don't we think of some solutions?
The kind of poverty heroin users experience is often well beyond anything you have. Homelessness, growing up with their parents on drugs is the kind of poverty cycle you can't just work your way out of.
"No demand, no drug dealers, no business."
The current method of trying to reduce demand by criminalising and policing its use has spectacularly failed. The only other way to reduce demand, and save massively on wasted policing costs, is to treat it as a medical issue and provide rehabilitation and medication.
Christ all that cultural revolution and fantastic music and you couldn't have a couple spliffs in the '60s? Might have done you some good, Rich. I don't know many stoners as abhorrent as you. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:33 - Feb 22 with 1877 views | lifelong |
It’s a perfectly reasonable question, are you suggesting there should be no age limit? | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:40 - Feb 22 with 1889 views | Drizzy |
If heroin was legalised it wouldn't be in the same way as alcohol and tobacco. It would be legal in the sense that its use is not a criminal offence for anyone of any age. Age limits are irrelevant because it's not going to be available to purchase by the general public.
If in extreme circumstances a person aged 12 was addicted to heroin and needed help then medical professionals would decide if prescription heroin was necessary. That'd be in tablet form by the way. We're not going to have kids shooting up in rehab centres, Lifey. [Post edited 22 Feb 2018 17:49]
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:44 - Feb 22 with 1865 views | Jackfath |
Drizzy, are you in employed as a drugs worker (for want of a better description)? | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 17:47 - Feb 22 with 1880 views | Drizzy |
Nope but I volunteer with charities that happen to work with former addicts. I don't have any experience, voluntary or paid, in drug rehab or anything similar. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 18:00 - Feb 22 with 1861 views | BarrySwan |
Well I'll tell you where I've been for the last 40 years.
Working in houses all over the country in order to support myself and pay income tax to fund the services that I use and to provide help for those less fortunate, not drug addled, a number of which houses occupied by the poor drug addicts that you describe who were busy boasting about how much they were getting from the 'Social' to spend on more drugs.
Working in houses having to order the engineers that I supervised to leave the properties because of a dirty needles being strewn all over the place including down the back of equipment and airing cupboards where unsuspecting workers would be putting their hands unaware of the dangers.
Insisting that local councils, strapped for cash, carry out expensive specialised cleaning of various tenants properties in order that the engineers under my supervision could return without the fear of being jabbed by a discarded needle.
I've also spent time listening to concerned parents campaigning for authorities to provide safe play areas for their children because of the amount of dirty syringes just left discarded in aforementioned play areas by the 'poor unfortunate drug addicts' that you have so much time for.
And only just the other day watched the latest in decades of documentaries ( as mentioned on the thread) showing the sheer unhelpable mess that many drug addicts are.
Of course these people are costing us all a fortune, thats my point, I personally am fed up of funding their habit. So I would like to see a stop to giving them money to fund their habits if they are unemployable and if they break the law lock them up and keep them locked up if they repeatedly offend.
That costs a fortune but I would be surprised to hear of a drug addict that has committed a burglary or a mugging or gone on a shoplifting spree or left discarded dangerously contaminated needles in a kids playground whilst behind bars.
And while we're on the matter what exactly is it about drug addicts that having 'shot up' they feel that it's ok to leave filthy contaminated syringes in childrens play areas as well as elsewhere for children and the rest of the public to potentially contract HIV, Hepatitis and a host of other virus' and diseases?
I understand from local authority workers and car salvage workers that I have spoken to that the first thing that they do when recovering an abandoned car is to thoroughly check the drivers seat because warped individuals find it amusing to put syringes pointed upwards through the seats.
Charming charming people.
I repeat.
If you are so enamoured with your local drug addicted community then you are more than welcome to plough as many resources and money of your own into 'helping them'.
I'm just asking you to stop volunteering everybody elses. | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 18:12 - Feb 22 with 1856 views | Shonky |
As it goes I am a trained drug worker and volunteered for three years at a charity, here in Swansea, who provide help to people with substance abuse issues. I agree with most of what you have said. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 18:15 - Feb 22 with 1852 views | nantywatcher |
I work with people who are working on their recovery from addiction and there is not one profile that fits all. To sugest that all addicts revert to crime to pay for their addiction is a nonsense.
Heroin, crack, meths etc etc reap a terrible price to be paid for by addicts, their family and friends. We need to spend, spend, spend on educating children at an early age to engage with the reality of addiction as opposed to the soft images portayed on television and film. It's a hideous illness, which, mostly, needs to be viewed with empathy.
Finally the problems caused through drugs are NOTHING compared to the chaos that alcohol causes. If, as a society, we cannot educate our children to understand alcohol's numerousharms (that are legally available) we have little chance in tackling the scourge of illegal drugs. | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 18:28 - Feb 22 with 1841 views | Drizzy |
Thanks for the anecdotes about drug addicts but I have to doubt whether they're true because of the incredulity of these actions makes it sounds like something read from Snopes rather than reality.
All you're doing is listing the terrible consequences of drug addiction in its potential harm to others. If you only purport a solution involving imprisonment then you're advocating the most expensive and least effective solution to the problems you've described. Locking them up so they can't cause any more damage doesn't work. The last 40 years have proved that.
Needles being strewn in public places is a disgusting sight but whether it's the last spiteful rebuttal of an addict or an indication of the desperate state of affairs is open to interpretation. Once again it doesn't excuse the actions of those that have no respect for property but you're creating a false dichotomy of respectful non-drug addicts and addicts who damage property through their actions.
Also while you persist with the costs let me just say the actions of drug addicts have *directly* affected my life as my parents' business was property management and the vast majority of their tenants were housing benefit tenants. So while you bleat on about the marginal contribution of your council tax it's cost my family thousands of pounds in cleaning and repairing the damage done to our own private property by drug addicts.
However, that doesn't mean I choose to demonise ALL drug addicts by the actions of a few. Nor does it mean I will advocate a failed authoritative policy of criminalising and policing. All I can see is empirical evidence that rehabilitation is the best way to reduce the harm to drug addicts and reduce the associated crime. If you can't because your lost in your narrow-mindedness then nothing I can say will change that.
The funny thing is rehabilitation would probably cost less overall than our current way and may prove to be far more successful. Of course it won't change because people like you who cannot grasp the notion of a drug addict being a kind and respectful person despite their habit. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 19:58 - Feb 22 with 1793 views | BarrySwan |
To be fair I've fully grasped the concept of a hopeless drug addict draining every last penny out of the rest of us in order to feed their addictions whilst whining that even more money should be spent on rehabilitation.
I've also grasped the concept of myself and other tax payers being forced to buy methadone on a regular basis for the same people.
How about someone pitching in for my Saturday night pint?
( I know that my mates might well argue in about me never buying a round anyway, but don't believe them I do occasionally )
I can only apologise for not providing photos and signed at the time statements from others in regards to my anecdotes, I hadn't realised at the time that I would have to provide physical proof
to yourself some years after the event. Oddly you then chunter on about how addicts have cost your parents £thousands thus backing up my examples. Once again you seem very forgiving about wasting other peoples property and money bearing in mind the thousands of 'Your parents' being milked of £millions countrywide each year.
Once again I point out that perhaps some of us are getting sick of do gooders volunteering all of our money and resources rather than just their own. For the last time you are perfectly entitled to direct every penny of your own in paying for drug addicts habits ( plus it appears that of your parents)
Stop demanding that the rest of us must do likewise, | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 20:41 - Feb 22 with 1775 views | dickythorpe |
"But for the grace of god go I". Those of us that aren't in any grasp of addiction are lucky, truly lucky.
Let us not judge. | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 21:17 - Feb 22 with 1757 views | BarrySwan |
Well lets judge.
And let addicts pay for their own weaknesses rather than expect others to pick up the tab. | | | |
| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 21:23 - Feb 22 with 1750 views | perchrockjack |
Nothing to do with God or grace
out of touch? my hairy arse.
You miss my point spectacularly and frankly I ve no further comment to make to you,drizzy
PLENTY helping druggies then but how many helping victims...you know those poor feckers who help feed their habit. Not all druggies turn to crime./ REALLY, you need a pretty good job to finance a drug life style legally.
Sadly,as with all things on here, too much empathy directed at the wrong people. | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 21:28 - Feb 22 with 1755 views | Darran |
What if someone had turned to drink or drugs after being sexually abused at the age of 14 by a famous actor? | |
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| Drugs map of Britain BBC1 last night - Swansea heroin on 21:37 - Feb 22 with 1750 views | Shonky |
And all smokers pay for their cancer treatment and all fat people pay for their heart bypass treatment etc. Its all 'weakness'. You fking tvvat. | |
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