| Trump v Zelensky 19:22 - Feb 28 with 27828 views | Drewster |
Absolutely bizarre scenes in the Oval Office today, staggering.
Trump and his VP clearly had a plan to ambush him, but to do it so publicly was bad form.
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| Trump v Zelensky on 07:22 - Mar 4 with 1921 views | Bluce_Ree |
Trump is an evil idiot.
People have been accusing him of being a Russian asset and now he's proving it.
In my opinion he is too emotionally fragile to have that job. Too much of a pro-Russian cocksucker too. |  |
| Stefan Moore, Stefan Moore running down the wing. Stefan Moore, Stefan Moore running down the wing. He runs like a cheetah, his crosses couldn't be sweeter. Stefan Moore. Stefan Moore. Stefan Moore. |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 07:25 - Mar 4 with 1919 views | ChrisNW6 |
| Trump v Zelensky on 06:54 - Mar 4 by loftboy |
Trump stopping his Aid now. |
Over to the US public to react now, I know they voted him in, but they are also facing jittery stock markets and a potential trade war. Hopefully we will also see a massive outpouring of support for Ukraine in the US.
Worrying times all round, need a strong Europe to ensure Ukraine survives as a sovereign state. |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:28 - Mar 4 with 1891 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
I cannot believe some of the misinformation and down right lies that some people on here spout defending Putin.
Either people are naive or downright fascist to come out with some of the comments, some clearly tinged with racist undertones.
Suggest some on here read Russian history and look at Russian Imperial maps to see Putins ideal end to this war. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:45 - Mar 4 with 1829 views | Juzzie |
“In an interview with Fox News a few hours ago, Vice-President JD Vance said the door was open for Ukraine to return to negotiations if Zelensky "is willing to seriously talk peace".
When he is ready to talk about what he is prepared to give up, Vance said, President Trump will be the first person to pick up the phone.”
That’s it in a nutshell. Ukraine have lost Donbas and if Zelensky agrees to give it up are the US willing to offer support should Putin decide to go west again or is the door now open for him to do that in the future without retaliation once he’s reorganised? |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:49 - Mar 4 with 1818 views | dmm |
| Trump v Zelensky on 08:45 - Mar 3 by TheChef |
All the world is a stage. |
...we're going through. |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:58 - Mar 4 with 1790 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:22 - Mar 4 by Bluce_Ree |
Trump is an evil idiot.
People have been accusing him of being a Russian asset and now he's proving it.
In my opinion he is too emotionally fragile to have that job. Too much of a pro-Russian cocksucker too. |
Hegseth pausing cyber counter intelligence against Russia soon after DOGE stole everyone's personal data is a clear sign who is pulling the strings now. The rush to get the next gen Starlink satellites up and running has ominous overtones too. |  |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 08:25 - Mar 4 with 1731 views | Sonic_Hoop |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:58 - Mar 4 by Esox_Lucius |
Hegseth pausing cyber counter intelligence against Russia soon after DOGE stole everyone's personal data is a clear sign who is pulling the strings now. The rush to get the next gen Starlink satellites up and running has ominous overtones too. |
To be fair, the Tories blocked the Russian interference report here too |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 08:28 - Mar 4 with 1720 views | Orthodox_Hoop |
| Trump v Zelensky on 07:28 - Mar 4 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
I cannot believe some of the misinformation and down right lies that some people on here spout defending Putin.
Either people are naive or downright fascist to come out with some of the comments, some clearly tinged with racist undertones.
Suggest some on here read Russian history and look at Russian Imperial maps to see Putins ideal end to this war. |
That's a serious accusation wilkins, can you give receipts on these fascist comments as I must have missed them. Absolutely no place for that here.
No place for racism here either - although I'm yet to see anything racist myself. Unfortunately I've witnessed actual racism on this message board with zero consequences or remorse, but as a previous poster pointed out "some people on LfW are more equal than others." |  | | |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 10:11 - Mar 4 with 1525 views | derbyhoop |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:27 - Mar 2 by derbyhoop |
Fundamentally, neither Ukraine, VZ nor W European leaders trust Putin. Trump/Vincent don't or don't want to understand those concerns. |
Why would anybody trust Putin to keep his word. First incursion into Ukraine was 2014, when they seized Crimea. Then, pause a few years before invading the Donbass.
If a ceasefire is agreed, to Trump's benefit, without security guarantees, Putin will just regroup and come again for the rest of Ukraine. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 10:21 - Mar 4 with 1480 views | QPunkR |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:11 - Mar 4 by derbyhoop |
Why would anybody trust Putin to keep his word. First incursion into Ukraine was 2014, when they seized Crimea. Then, pause a few years before invading the Donbass.
If a ceasefire is agreed, to Trump's benefit, without security guarantees, Putin will just regroup and come again for the rest of Ukraine. |
100% - there is not a single doubt in my mind about this.
However, how to proceed and not allow that to happen is another matter entirely. My opinion is that it does actually require a U.S. backstop unfortunately - simply because it is too dangerous to admit Ukraine into NATO (if that organisation even exists in a couple of months). Plus the possibility of Ukraine joining was realistically the straw that broke the camel's back and persuaded Putin to invade in the first place |  |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 10:23 - Mar 4 with 1465 views | ChrisNW6 |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:11 - Mar 4 by derbyhoop |
Why would anybody trust Putin to keep his word. First incursion into Ukraine was 2014, when they seized Crimea. Then, pause a few years before invading the Donbass.
If a ceasefire is agreed, to Trump's benefit, without security guarantees, Putin will just regroup and come again for the rest of Ukraine. |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live/bbc_radio_five_live?partner=uk.co.bbc&
Worth listening to John Sweeney (9:05) his views are really interesting and come from a place of first hand experience.
#sexkompromat | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:34 - Mar 4 with 1424 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Trump v Zelensky on 08:25 - Mar 4 by Sonic_Hoop |
To be fair, the Tories blocked the Russian interference report here too |
Firing all his Chiefs of staff and J.A.G's so as to remove any control over what he can do with the U.S. armed services too. Is there any doubt now over his being a Russian asset? | |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| Trump v Zelensky on 10:52 - Mar 4 with 1335 views | essextaxiboy |
| Trump v Zelensky on 08:28 - Mar 4 by Orthodox_Hoop |
That's a serious accusation wilkins, can you give receipts on these fascist comments as I must have missed them. Absolutely no place for that here.
No place for racism here either - although I'm yet to see anything racist myself. Unfortunately I've witnessed actual racism on this message board with zero consequences or remorse, but as a previous poster pointed out "some people on LfW are more equal than others." |
Your last paragraph is a serious accusation . I think you should retract it or link to an historic example of it it . |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:59 - Mar 4 with 1284 views | Juzzie |
Something else I noticed, if I may, towards the end of the spat last Friday..... Trump looked at the people in front of him and said "It’s going to be very hard to do business like this".
This is the problem, it's not business. It's politics/diplomacy. I don't even think it's a turn of phrase either, he really does mean 'business'.
This I think is why Vance blew up when Zelensky asked what the diplomacy was because they don't know, they don't do diplomacy. They probably don't even know how to because they do business and business that is entirely on their terms with no regards for the consequences of that to other parties.
So, their idea of peace is for Ukraine to lose 20% of it's land, it's natural resources and still have the threat of further incursion from Putin into their land.
Sure, it'll mean people will stop dying, for now, but at huge cost to the country and its people.
If it does mean it's over you can bet your bottom dollar Trump will claim to be a glorious peacekeeper and Putin will absolutely milk it for all he's worth. How he oversaw a glorious victory and 'protected' the sovereign motherland & liberated the Russian Donbas area (remember the clearly rigged 2014 referendum that voted 96.2% in favour of the Donbas aligning to Russia?) and will, as said above, use the time to regroup and go again in a few years. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:27 - Mar 4 with 1153 views | Orthodox_Hoop |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:52 - Mar 4 by essextaxiboy |
Your last paragraph is a serious accusation . I think you should retract it or link to an historic example of it it . |
You're right - I'll retract that. The previous threads are there I assume and don't have the will to trawl through them, nor know how to link them.
I can see this thread is going down the road of previous ones so for Clive's sanity I'll take a step back and hope for a dignified peace for the Ukrainian people and leave it there. [Post edited 4 Mar 11:27]
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| Trump v Zelensky on 11:30 - Mar 4 with 1138 views | Juzzie |
No might about it, that is what the US want. They were hoping Zelensky would sign the deal last week but without any assurances of security against Putin. When the US wouldn't give this, he wouldn't sign. Who can blame him.
This is what Lindsay Graham was talking about after the meeting. He was basically complaining that Zelensky hadn't signed the resources deal so they could then discuss afterwards the security aspects. Once the deal signed, that weakens Zelensky massively as he has no bargaining chip (or 'cards') and is what infuriated Trump because he didn't get what he wanted and had a tantrum. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:44 - Mar 4 with 1063 views | flynnbo |
Don't forget Vance's role in all this. Overnight, he referred to the UK as some random country who hasn't fought a war in 30 years. What respect and thanks has he shown for our heroic servicemen and women killed in action supporting the US? |  | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:48 - Mar 4 with 1050 views | Clive_Anderson |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:30 - Mar 4 by Juzzie |
No might about it, that is what the US want. They were hoping Zelensky would sign the deal last week but without any assurances of security against Putin. When the US wouldn't give this, he wouldn't sign. Who can blame him.
This is what Lindsay Graham was talking about after the meeting. He was basically complaining that Zelensky hadn't signed the resources deal so they could then discuss afterwards the security aspects. Once the deal signed, that weakens Zelensky massively as he has no bargaining chip (or 'cards') and is what infuriated Trump because he didn't get what he wanted and had a tantrum. |
The US can't give security assurances against Russia, because say Russia continue to attack then you are in WW3 and the nukes could start flying shortly after.
The minerals deal was to get US "security" into Ukraine as a form of soft power to protect US interests which would deter Putin from attacking further without the danger of it triggering an official direct conflict.
The way people have lost their minds at Trump having a go at Zelensky on TV, but are happy for the Ukrainian people to continue to be slaughtered daily for a few years completely baffles me. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:07 - Mar 4 with 961 views | Juzzie |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:48 - Mar 4 by Clive_Anderson |
The US can't give security assurances against Russia, because say Russia continue to attack then you are in WW3 and the nukes could start flying shortly after.
The minerals deal was to get US "security" into Ukraine as a form of soft power to protect US interests which would deter Putin from attacking further without the danger of it triggering an official direct conflict.
The way people have lost their minds at Trump having a go at Zelensky on TV, but are happy for the Ukrainian people to continue to be slaughtered daily for a few years completely baffles me. |
What do you think is the ideal outcome... Sign the resources deal to get that soft protection but lose 20% of your land?
Feels to me Zelensky can't get what he wants, basically Donbas back, so has to decide what is the best compromise. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:10 - Mar 4 with 956 views | Watford_Ranger |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:44 - Mar 4 by flynnbo |
Don't forget Vance's role in all this. Overnight, he referred to the UK as some random country who hasn't fought a war in 30 years. What respect and thanks has he shown for our heroic servicemen and women killed in action supporting the US? |
He comes across as a bit of an oaf. The Bircham assistant to our Holloway. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:38 - Mar 4 with 871 views | Clive_Anderson |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:07 - Mar 4 by Juzzie |
What do you think is the ideal outcome... Sign the resources deal to get that soft protection but lose 20% of your land?
Feels to me Zelensky can't get what he wants, basically Donbas back, so has to decide what is the best compromise. |
I don't think there is an ideal outcome from here.
Sign a peace deal, avoid WW3, but lose 20% of land and hope war doesn't break out again in a few years is about the best that can be hoped for.
Why prolong it further without the prospect of any of these options improving while losing countless men? | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:44 - Mar 4 with 846 views | Landshark |
| Trump v Zelensky on 11:44 - Mar 4 by flynnbo |
Don't forget Vance's role in all this. Overnight, he referred to the UK as some random country who hasn't fought a war in 30 years. What respect and thanks has he shown for our heroic servicemen and women killed in action supporting the US? |
Vance, the guy who once said that Trump will be "Americas Hitler" and made various other negative remarks about him. The guy is a tool, in footballing terms he's a glory hunter, jumping on whatever bandwagon that will further his career. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:45 - Mar 4 with 837 views | Landshark |
This was a very interesting listen. Thank you. | | | |
| Trump v Zelensky on 12:47 - Mar 4 with 821 views | Harbour |
| Trump v Zelensky on 10:11 - Mar 4 by derbyhoop |
Why would anybody trust Putin to keep his word. First incursion into Ukraine was 2014, when they seized Crimea. Then, pause a few years before invading the Donbass.
If a ceasefire is agreed, to Trump's benefit, without security guarantees, Putin will just regroup and come again for the rest of Ukraine. |
Yes I think Putin has said Ukraine is Russian so his intentions are to invade the whole Country so can’t see how this will end. A ceasefire may get him time to rearm.I truly hope there is a way to find peace and Russia and Ukraine find a lasting settlement. The buffer zone like in Korea may be a solution? | | | |
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