| Pitch update on 08:41 - Jan 13 with 3771 views | TalkingSutty |
| Pitch update on 06:10 - Jan 13 by Plattyswrinklynuts |
FWIW my take on the pitch is this….
Spend the money. We’ve already thrown good money after bad at this. It’s far from ideal but the only source of funding for the job is the new owners. I’m sure this wasn’t part of the initial plan but no pitch = no club.
I’m skeptical as to whether we’ll see any compensation, any pitch laying company would put caveats into a contract re pitch upkeep, did the club follow instructions?
As to the work required. Demolish the Sandy, do a full rip up of the existing pitch, including drainage & start from scratch. Drains to run out to Sandy Lane. Then rebuild as a standing terrace but with improved toilet facilities etc, possibly put solar panels on the roof to cut electricity costs?
Ground share. Agree that sharing with Bury is a bad idea for reasons already stated, perhaps (although not ideal) a short term deal with City to use the athletics stadium next to the Etihad? It’s a fair distance but transport connections are good with regular trams from the city centre. Presumably we already have some dialogue with them as we’re using Platt Lane to train? Hornets to agree a similar deal with Mayfield?
Thoughts? |
Not sure if this is feasible, i suspect it's not at the moment but my thoughts are more radical than that.
I think the Ogdens need to have a serious conversation about relocating the club within the borough and starting afresh. It would need to be in partnership with the council and other community groups and maybe retail /leisure/college/ education providers. It would require a professional and knowledgeable team to drive the plans forward and help to access funding and grants along the way. Hornets need to be fully involved also.
The whole club needs to change from top to bottom and redeveloping Spotland could be a case of throwing good money after bad. Then there are the perceived problems in respect of planning permission and parking restrictions in a residential area. The plan is to have a stadium that is making money 365 days of the year and being utilised not only for sport but also for leisure and education purposes. I dont think the current location is conducive to all of that and the footfall/ parking and noise issues that come with it. It would be a wrench to leave but going forward i think relocation, alongside a training complex and leisure facilities would be the best option to make the club self sustainable.
I also wouldnt close my mind to amalgamating with another local club, in the long term i think that is going to be a option that many lower league clubs look at. In the meantime i think we will just continue to apply expensive sticking plasters to the pitch and it will be a annual problem. Obviously others will have a different opinion to that but i'm trying to envisage what lower league football clubs and how they generate finance looks like in 10/20/30 years time. [Post edited 13 Jan 9:32]
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| Pitch update on 09:33 - Jan 13 with 3556 views | dawlishdale |
Agree with relocating to a new multi-purpose site (are there any suitable ones at Kingsway?) but I'm not open to an amalgamation with a nearby club. Fully agree that changes are needed throughout the Board and staff at the club. Unfortunately, all this will come at considerable cost. |  | | |
| Pitch update on 09:43 - Jan 13 with 3503 views | TalkingSutty |
| Pitch update on 09:33 - Jan 13 by dawlishdale |
Agree with relocating to a new multi-purpose site (are there any suitable ones at Kingsway?) but I'm not open to an amalgamation with a nearby club. Fully agree that changes are needed throughout the Board and staff at the club. Unfortunately, all this will come at considerable cost. |
Would you rather the club cease to exist at all, rather than start a new venture with a local club? I'm asking that question as a worse case scenario. | | | |
| Pitch update on 09:49 - Jan 13 with 3469 views | dawlishdale |
| Pitch update on 09:43 - Jan 13 by TalkingSutty |
Would you rather the club cease to exist at all, rather than start a new venture with a local club? I'm asking that question as a worse case scenario. |
Difficult one to answer, and would depend on who the other club was. Personally, if it were Oldham or bury, I would rather we never considered it. I think this would be a hugely divisive issue with both parties; don't you? | | | |
| Pitch update on 10:07 - Jan 13 with 3395 views | James1980 |
Speaking to someone towards the end of last season who said on the local plan, there is a site out of town earmarked for a sports stadium, . | |
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| Pitch update on 11:08 - Jan 13 with 3276 views | Rochdalian45 |
What is Dryjeting that they talk about ?
In summer time Cricket clubs soak water off the pitch using a machine similar to a roller. Is that a possible solution. Just asking for a friend. | | | |
| Pitch update on 11:44 - Jan 13 with 3172 views | Dale_4_Life |
I would not want to move from Spotland BUT if we got a new Chesterfield or York scenario i could see the benefit.
No to a merger though (been mooted for at least 25 years) Manchester North End?.
The club needs to get the drains and the pitch sorted once and for all. When the drains are sorted a ride on water hog would also be a good investment one that can take all surface water off the pitch when it really teams down. Below removes 6000 gallons an hour OFF the playing surface and then you water cannon it down a drain of your choice.
WaterHOG uses a patented pumping process to pick-up standing water from your playing or event surface enabling water to be removed and disposed of at a location of your choice.
WaterHOG is available in two sizes to accommodate large and small areas:
WaterHOG Rider
Motorized Riding Model
Picks up 6,000+ gallons of water per hour
11 HP engine
• Operates at 6-10mph
•Water disposal through high-pressure cannon or storage tank
• Ground pressure of only 2 pounds per square inch | | | |
| Pitch update on 12:23 - Jan 13 with 3063 views | TalkingSutty |
| Pitch update on 09:49 - Jan 13 by dawlishdale |
Difficult one to answer, and would depend on who the other club was. Personally, if it were Oldham or bury, I would rather we never considered it. I think this would be a hugely divisive issue with both parties; don't you? |
Well it depends what the state of football looks like at the time. Both the Dale and Oldham are financed by wealthy owners without them both clubs might no longer be here. Bury FC have already disappeared, they didn't live to fight another day. So that's three clubs all within walking distance of each other. It would be divisive but it would be better than having no local football club to support. All three Towns have now lost their football league status and projecting forward i don't see how finances at this level are going to greatly improve. Rivalry is all well and good but not if eventually we all end up cutting each other's throats. As i said its radical but things will have to change and I'd prefer the Ogden family to look at the bigger picture rather than just plugging the financial deficit at the current stadium. So a move to a new location in the Town is my preference for the future of the club and it's ultimate goal of sustainability. The footprint of the current stadium and the surrounding area limits our options when it comes to maximising our chances of sustainability i think. [Post edited 13 Jan 12:31]
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| Pitch update on 12:39 - Jan 13 with 3002 views | D_Alien |
| Pitch update on 12:23 - Jan 13 by TalkingSutty |
Well it depends what the state of football looks like at the time. Both the Dale and Oldham are financed by wealthy owners without them both clubs might no longer be here. Bury FC have already disappeared, they didn't live to fight another day. So that's three clubs all within walking distance of each other. It would be divisive but it would be better than having no local football club to support. All three Towns have now lost their football league status and projecting forward i don't see how finances at this level are going to greatly improve. Rivalry is all well and good but not if eventually we all end up cutting each other's throats. As i said its radical but things will have to change and I'd prefer the Ogden family to look at the bigger picture rather than just plugging the financial deficit at the current stadium. So a move to a new location in the Town is my preference for the future of the club and it's ultimate goal of sustainability. The footprint of the current stadium and the surrounding area limits our options when it comes to maximising our chances of sustainability i think. [Post edited 13 Jan 12:31]
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I'd be very much in favour of a new stadium, with training and all other facilities envisaged by the Ogdens within the town. Plus, the sale of land at Spotland would greatly help with financing this. Local councils are being pressured to find places for new housing, and it's starting to encroach on Green Belt so i reckon they wouldn't put any obstacles in the way of this
The obvious place would be Kingsway. Sir Peter Ogden grew up near there, and for Hornets it'd be a return to their old stomping ground. It'd also be a way of attracting the attention of the townsfolk in a way that would be self-publicising - a new ground for a new era |  |
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| Pitch update on 12:58 - Jan 13 with 2922 views | TalkingSutty |
| Pitch update on 12:39 - Jan 13 by D_Alien |
I'd be very much in favour of a new stadium, with training and all other facilities envisaged by the Ogdens within the town. Plus, the sale of land at Spotland would greatly help with financing this. Local councils are being pressured to find places for new housing, and it's starting to encroach on Green Belt so i reckon they wouldn't put any obstacles in the way of this
The obvious place would be Kingsway. Sir Peter Ogden grew up near there, and for Hornets it'd be a return to their old stomping ground. It'd also be a way of attracting the attention of the townsfolk in a way that would be self-publicising - a new ground for a new era |
Those are my feelings, i look at Spotland today and envisage if the club will still be going in thirty years time in its current format. It's showing its age and it's expensive to run, especially as a non league club. It just feels to me as though the time has arrived to consider relocating and the money that needs spending on the pitch and infrastrucre brings that into even more focus. I'm a older fan and we don't like change, I'd be interested to hear what the young fans think because they are the future
[Post edited 13 Jan 13:00]
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| Pitch update on 13:11 - Jan 13 with 2859 views | Walboro |
I posted on here a number of years ago when all the development on Kingsway was starting to take off. It would be an ideal position close to the motorway network with the possibility of better parking a place for training facilities and hotel which has already been mentioned. But we are where we are and have to be grateful that we have a club to support when the weather permits. | | | |
| Pitch update on 14:11 - Jan 13 with 2695 views | ThreeLions |
| Pitch update on 12:39 - Jan 13 by D_Alien |
I'd be very much in favour of a new stadium, with training and all other facilities envisaged by the Ogdens within the town. Plus, the sale of land at Spotland would greatly help with financing this. Local councils are being pressured to find places for new housing, and it's starting to encroach on Green Belt so i reckon they wouldn't put any obstacles in the way of this
The obvious place would be Kingsway. Sir Peter Ogden grew up near there, and for Hornets it'd be a return to their old stomping ground. It'd also be a way of attracting the attention of the townsfolk in a way that would be self-publicising - a new ground for a new era |
Kingsway is pretty much full now isn't it? Don't think there's enough space for a stadium and training facilities now anyway
Edit- just had a look on Google maps there is some land behind the JD Sports warehouse but not sure if it's already allocated for something [Post edited 13 Jan 14:15]
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| Pitch update on 14:46 - Jan 13 with 2594 views | Duckegg |
I quite like the way Middlebrook is set up with the retail park and the stadium...
Perhaps something on a smaller scale with provisions upon expansion... |  | | |
| Pitch update on 14:46 - Jan 13 with 2593 views | EllDale |
| Pitch update on 13:11 - Jan 13 by Walboro |
I posted on here a number of years ago when all the development on Kingsway was starting to take off. It would be an ideal position close to the motorway network with the possibility of better parking a place for training facilities and hotel which has already been mentioned. But we are where we are and have to be grateful that we have a club to support when the weather permits. |
As I mentioned on another thread last year Kingsway is also accessible by tram and bus. | | | |
| Pitch update on 15:28 - Jan 13 with 2476 views | wozzrafc |
| Pitch update on 14:46 - Jan 13 by EllDale |
As I mentioned on another thread last year Kingsway is also accessible by tram and bus. |
I actually think looking at the potential of moving to a purpose built stadium is a perfectly reasonable thing to consider. Other clubs (Shrewsbury springs to mind) have made it work.
It would however need a number of parties to come together such as the council and Hornets to make it happen with issues impacting not only the sporting clubs but the towns development plan. A coordinated approach could produce facilities beneficial to both the sporting clubs aim to be sustainable and to the greater Rochdale public at large.
This of course takes time and would be a long term plan. In the short to medium term we would still have to ensure that we have a suitable playing surface at Spotland regardless .
This would however explain why they are going to take advice. Whether it be to relocate to a new stadium or as others have muted a substantial financial investment at facilities /infrastructure at Spotland there may be a reluctance to spend any more than necessary on the pitch in the short term if it can avoided, if permanent repairs are planed as part of a bigger project.( I’m not saying that’s correct or good idea either way).
We have yet to hear about the long term vision for the club from the Ogdens, hopefully the forthcoming forum will give them the opportunity to put forward there plans. This will include the level of financial backing they are prepared to invest. I am hopeful that this would be bigger commitment than the initial funds they have put in through their share investment.
Either way they will need to find a solution that first gets us through this season, and then the new few seasons. | | | |
| Pitch update on 15:34 - Jan 13 with 2448 views | EllDale |
I wonder if the Ogdens ever think “what the hell have we taken on?” by taking over at Dale? | | | |
| Pitch update on 15:55 - Jan 13 with 2393 views | TalkingSutty |
| Pitch update on 15:34 - Jan 13 by EllDale |
I wonder if the Ogdens ever think “what the hell have we taken on?” by taking over at Dale? |
I don't think so, they said that they want to leave a legacy in the Town and being involved with the football club ties in with sport and recreation, education and health. A sporting complex which benefits the whole Town and brings thousands of people together every week or two to watch live football/ rugby is what the Town needs. Incorporate a sports hall, swimming pool , artificial pitches and classrooms etc and that would be a fantastic facility for the whole of the borough. | | | |
| Pitch update on 16:29 - Jan 13 with 2307 views | wozzrafc |
| Pitch update on 15:55 - Jan 13 by TalkingSutty |
I don't think so, they said that they want to leave a legacy in the Town and being involved with the football club ties in with sport and recreation, education and health. A sporting complex which benefits the whole Town and brings thousands of people together every week or two to watch live football/ rugby is what the Town needs. Incorporate a sports hall, swimming pool , artificial pitches and classrooms etc and that would be a fantastic facility for the whole of the borough. |
I would tend to agree sutty. I’m sure the Ogdens will have known that in order to protect Rochdale AFC as a community asset it would require investment beyond the initial funding made to see through last season, and the capital generated by their purchase of unissued shares.
As yet however we haven’t been informed of the extent of their ambitions, other than the plan to make the club sustainable including returning the club to the league. Hopefully some of this will become clear at the up coming forum. | | | |
| Pitch update on 23:09 - Jan 13 with 1699 views | Yorkshire_Dale |
Good to see the Club is fighting back against this adversity. | | | |
| Pitch update on 09:46 - Jan 14 with 1288 views | ramsdale |
| Pitch update on 12:58 - Jan 13 by TalkingSutty |
Those are my feelings, i look at Spotland today and envisage if the club will still be going in thirty years time in its current format. It's showing its age and it's expensive to run, especially as a non league club. It just feels to me as though the time has arrived to consider relocating and the money that needs spending on the pitch and infrastrucre brings that into even more focus. I'm a older fan and we don't like change, I'd be interested to hear what the young fans think because they are the future
[Post edited 13 Jan 13:00]
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As a *younger* fan rather than *young*, emotionally it would be just as difficult for us to leave Spotland. I've personally been going for 20 years, so it's hard to imagine us playing somewhere else. It's home.
However, as points have already been raised in this thread about the amount of work we need to do to the pitch and the facilities, the impact/legacy that the Ogden family wants to leave on the town, the current transport links, and not currently having our own training facility, it's the perfect time to at least consider it.
Having been to places such as Doncaster & York, whilst fit for purpose, I feel like they are completely soulless and don't think I could enjoy rocking up to a ground like that 23 times a season. If we did move, we would have to get it right and bring the soul and tradition with us.
On a personal level, I'd be pretty peeved if we did end up moving to Kingsway having lived in Milnrow for 95% of my life only to move 18 months ago. | | | |
| Pitch update on 11:16 - Jan 14 with 1109 views | Trev |
Assuming the funding and an appropriate site could be found I don't understand how anybody could object to the idea of a new stadium.
We have a ground way out of the town centre away from train and tram links with insufficient parking. A dated standing terrace with rubbish views. Uncomfortable and tight seating in the main stand. A rubbish atmosphere with fans too spread out with any noise generated from The Sandy lost due to rubbish acoustics. Sub-standard bars, kiosks and hospitality areas and a pitch with zero drainage. Other than that it's great.
I know there's always an emotional connection but if we want to build the fan-base we need to improve the fan experience. This could be the biggest transformative event in the club's history if done properly. A facility that can house a training ground and community hub and generate income 7 days a week has to be considered, surely? | | | |
| Pitch update on 12:01 - Jan 14 with 1007 views | dingdangblue |
Interesting article from 2011!
Staggering costs back then to sort out a pitch drainage problem - god knows what the quote would be today to do it properly. Im pretty sure we spent nothing like that amount when the new drains were installed a few years ago (£50,000 rings a bell - which might be why they've failed?). 14 years later and worse than ever.
https://www.rochdaleonline.co.uk/news-features/4/sport-news/53417/%E2%80%98no-ea |  |
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| Pitch update on 13:07 - Jan 14 with 898 views | 49thseason |
| Pitch update on 14:11 - Jan 13 by ThreeLions |
Kingsway is pretty much full now isn't it? Don't think there's enough space for a stadium and training facilities now anyway
Edit- just had a look on Google maps there is some land behind the JD Sports warehouse but not sure if it's already allocated for something [Post edited 13 Jan 14:15]
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The annoying thing about Kingsway is that we were promised it would not become a collection of big sheds employing relatively few people... but thats exactly what happened...Politicians eh? Can't trust them any further than you can throw them...
If you search the council website there are dozens of expensive reports comparing Rochdale with other towns in Greater Manchester, the Northwest and England, and on just about every measure we are the poor man, literally and metaphorically. Politicians have sold off one of the biggest ( and therefore valuable) sites in Europe, per the initial blurb, for pennies and attracted exactly what they said they didnt want. Imagine what a big conference centre, a major entertainment venue and a football stadium, attendant hotels, a truck stop, etc. all on the edge of town and situated on one of the country's busiest motorways, within an hour of a bigger population than London, might have done for employment in Rochdale !
But no what we got were warehouses needing forklift drivers, pickers and not much else. And guess what.. they will end up with exactly the same at Atom Valley despite their grandiose plans because at the end of the day highly mobile, talented people will choose to live and work somewhere else... imagine working in London or Edinburgh, Oxford , Cambridge or even Paris or Rome and announcing that you are moving to Rochdale especially given the press coverage we are currently getting.....its just not going to happen..... |  | | |
| Pitch update on 14:05 - Jan 14 with 769 views | D_Alien |
| Pitch update on 13:07 - Jan 14 by 49thseason |
The annoying thing about Kingsway is that we were promised it would not become a collection of big sheds employing relatively few people... but thats exactly what happened...Politicians eh? Can't trust them any further than you can throw them...
If you search the council website there are dozens of expensive reports comparing Rochdale with other towns in Greater Manchester, the Northwest and England, and on just about every measure we are the poor man, literally and metaphorically. Politicians have sold off one of the biggest ( and therefore valuable) sites in Europe, per the initial blurb, for pennies and attracted exactly what they said they didnt want. Imagine what a big conference centre, a major entertainment venue and a football stadium, attendant hotels, a truck stop, etc. all on the edge of town and situated on one of the country's busiest motorways, within an hour of a bigger population than London, might have done for employment in Rochdale !
But no what we got were warehouses needing forklift drivers, pickers and not much else. And guess what.. they will end up with exactly the same at Atom Valley despite their grandiose plans because at the end of the day highly mobile, talented people will choose to live and work somewhere else... imagine working in London or Edinburgh, Oxford , Cambridge or even Paris or Rome and announcing that you are moving to Rochdale especially given the press coverage we are currently getting.....its just not going to happen..... |
So why would those people who you claim wouldn't want to move close to Rochdale now, have done so back when Kingsway was being opened? | |
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