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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 16:49 - Jul 13 by PhilmyRs
Perhaps that was the approach so slightly different but if your Manager, in front of all your teammates asks whether you'd take a pen, you're not going to say No are you, even if you hate the idea and don't think you have it in you. Asking the group who fancies a pen and gaging responses/whose up for it is pretty old school and isn't perfect but I just get the feeling a Grealish or even the keeper would have fancied a bit of the action, Pickford particularly that night was enjoying the occassion and the more nervous players (e.g. Saka) could have taken a step back. Saka definitely shouldn't have been on the final pen.
All what ifs though. Maybe in a week or two I'll have moved on.
you'd hope most players especially the attacking ones will want to take one, thats what they have trained to do for years and although you can end up being the villian it's also a chance to become a legend. I think everyone would agree if we could do it again Saka wouldn't take the last one although i did think Sanchos penalty was far worse, absolutely telegraphed where he was going to put it.
I don't think there is a perfect way to do it. Only ever look smart if you win. We've seen before holding your best taker till last like Portugal did in 2010 with Ronaldo and they were out before he took one so it backfired.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:14 - Jul 13 with 1812 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:04 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
No, I get that, I work for a mental health trust, have required counselling myself in the last couple of years, but this isn't really anything to do with Social media abuse. This is just life.
The idea that protecting footballers from monkey emojis on Twitter is gonna prevent suicides is a bit speculative at it's absolute most pumped up best.
There's an argument that players should come off Social Media platforms if they cant handle negative engagements and I understand that.
There's an argument that players can change who can reply to their Tweets and what notifications they receive and I understand that.
There's an argument that players should rise above these idiots and put faith into the old adage about 'sticks and stones' and I understand that too.
The problem is that there's a not a one size fits all approach that will work and every player needs to find their own solution.
If it were me I'd probably block and move on. I probably wouldn't event report it because in the era of partisan football 'fanship' once you've admitted that you find it offensive you've opened up a can of worms which isn't going to get better. These players play for clubs whose rivals are 'supported'/followed by millions across the World and some of those will be idiots who like to prove how much they 'support' their club by abusing a rival club's players.
However, I'm me and they are them. I find the youngsters inability to stay off their phones and Social Media for more than 5 minutes bizarre but it's their life and the burgeoning culture among under 30s across the Globe.
There isn't a quick fix however because once the abuse is presented in language such as 'I don't like you because you are black' there is nothing anyone can do about it. They may be an idiot but they're an idiot who hasn't broken the law.
All I will say is that thank God we never had Social Media when we were kids, it's the worst invention ever.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:38 - Jul 13 with 1735 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 14:10 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
Lost me at "I don't know how you conclude that booing someone else's national anthem makes you more patriotic. It really, really doesn't."
Where did I conclude this ?
[Post edited 13 Jul 2021 14:11]
"As I said to a few friends last night; "So, they had to turn the volume down on the Italian national anthem, because of the booing. Gotta love football supporters......." English football has always been a national disgrace and will always be a national disgrace. Having not watched an England game for something akin 30 years, due to the media and the "supporters" jingoistic attitude towards the game, I can safely say I shan't be watching another game any time soon. Apologies, from an Englishman, who has a particular distaste for most of the people that reside in the country I was born in."
This is the sort of tired shit I see on my facebook
Thanks for the tiny violin, but entirely unnecessary because I wasn't telling any sob story.
You implied in a series of posts that not enjoying booing and looking down on yobbish behaviour was entirely a left wing pursuit and was akin to being unpatriotic. Based on a sample of a few people down the pub. But having nuance means that just because you don't like the behaviour of a few people from a particular grouping, doesn't mean you condemn and despise everyone that comes from that category. So because I dislike yobs that boo other people's national anthem, doesn't mean I dislike all England Football fans, or all right wingers or all people that like football.
And as for the trope that because you're rich or successful you're immune from abuse, it's surely obviously been debunked by now. Please don't go around spreading the idea that only particular people are allowed to struggle with their mental health. There are lots of published studies about social media and its affects on mental health. I'd trust what's written in peer-reviewed journals above what's written by some random on a football site.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:52 - Jul 13 with 1670 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:38 - Jul 13 by nix
"As I said to a few friends last night; "So, they had to turn the volume down on the Italian national anthem, because of the booing. Gotta love football supporters......." English football has always been a national disgrace and will always be a national disgrace. Having not watched an England game for something akin 30 years, due to the media and the "supporters" jingoistic attitude towards the game, I can safely say I shan't be watching another game any time soon. Apologies, from an Englishman, who has a particular distaste for most of the people that reside in the country I was born in."
This is the sort of tired shit I see on my facebook
Thanks for the tiny violin, but entirely unnecessary because I wasn't telling any sob story.
You implied in a series of posts that not enjoying booing and looking down on yobbish behaviour was entirely a left wing pursuit and was akin to being unpatriotic. Based on a sample of a few people down the pub. But having nuance means that just because you don't like the behaviour of a few people from a particular grouping, doesn't mean you condemn and despise everyone that comes from that category. So because I dislike yobs that boo other people's national anthem, doesn't mean I dislike all England Football fans, or all right wingers or all people that like football.
And as for the trope that because you're rich or successful you're immune from abuse, it's surely obviously been debunked by now. Please don't go around spreading the idea that only particular people are allowed to struggle with their mental health. There are lots of published studies about social media and its affects on mental health. I'd trust what's written in peer-reviewed journals above what's written by some random on a football site.
It is tired shit. Is boring old narratives about England football fans, being used to stick the boot in on anyone and everyone who attends football.
Konk thought that bloke was a tw at. You don't. Fair enough.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:04 - Jul 13 with 1664 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 16:32 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
Yeah this is why young people now use completely illegible phrases like "yt pipo" to actually say "White people" and stuff like that. It's not really new. Bit like Instagram filtering messages from accounts you don't follow isn't new.
But it's still a problem because people go looking for stuff.
What next? Emoji no longer allowed to use Monkey or Banana iconography? In case it gets used in a racist way? Isn't this a bit ridiculous?
[Post edited 13 Jul 2021 16:41]
To me I can't understand what makes someone want to send a message to a footballer or anyone really with the intent to abuse or belittle them, maybe it makes them feel better about themselves like a a school bully but it really has to stop.
Ultimately there is only so much social media companies can do, they need to do more but it really comes down to human decency and setting standards in society which comes from the top and I don't think either of the main two political parties in this country have covered themselves in glory with regard to racism and general verbal abuse in recent years. This has been turned into a left/right issue but it's just common human decency whatever party you vote for and we are miles away from it at the moment. I never knew or cared who my mates voted for but now whichever side you vote for you are called abusive names by the other. It's become a sport where your political party is now akin to your football team and you defend them at all costs even when they are in the wrong.
I completely agree with Gary Neville when he said a lot of this started again due to the way Brexit was debated with both sides very confrontational and abusive to each other and that has continued with every issue in society since. Until we get back to a time where people respect each other again this is only going to get worse. We've reached a stage now where footballers are saying they are making a protest before games to promote racial equality and it gets booed. Rather than understand and respect what they are doing even if you disagree with it people have to make their voices known to abuse a very simple protest which just creates even greater division. When the Prime Minister said it was OK to boo that gesture all bets were off as it was then open season to say what you want and you will always get absolute scumbags who take it too far and the leaders all row back in panic.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:11 - Jul 13 with 1610 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:38 - Jul 13 by nix
"As I said to a few friends last night; "So, they had to turn the volume down on the Italian national anthem, because of the booing. Gotta love football supporters......." English football has always been a national disgrace and will always be a national disgrace. Having not watched an England game for something akin 30 years, due to the media and the "supporters" jingoistic attitude towards the game, I can safely say I shan't be watching another game any time soon. Apologies, from an Englishman, who has a particular distaste for most of the people that reside in the country I was born in."
This is the sort of tired shit I see on my facebook
Thanks for the tiny violin, but entirely unnecessary because I wasn't telling any sob story.
You implied in a series of posts that not enjoying booing and looking down on yobbish behaviour was entirely a left wing pursuit and was akin to being unpatriotic. Based on a sample of a few people down the pub. But having nuance means that just because you don't like the behaviour of a few people from a particular grouping, doesn't mean you condemn and despise everyone that comes from that category. So because I dislike yobs that boo other people's national anthem, doesn't mean I dislike all England Football fans, or all right wingers or all people that like football.
And as for the trope that because you're rich or successful you're immune from abuse, it's surely obviously been debunked by now. Please don't go around spreading the idea that only particular people are allowed to struggle with their mental health. There are lots of published studies about social media and its affects on mental health. I'd trust what's written in peer-reviewed journals above what's written by some random on a football site.
Nix. Believe me, he isn't worth the hassle of anticipation/dread of waiting to see what response you receive from him.
I've had him on & off ignore for quite a while, but I'm pleased that I've not been able to read any of his postings on this thread.
Please remember "Taking the knee is a political action, booing that action is not political. It's an entitlement of free speech"! Just one of the many gems I read before putting him back on ignore.
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:22 - Jul 13 by terryb
Nix. Believe me, he isn't worth the hassle of anticipation/dread of waiting to see what response you receive from him.
I've had him on & off ignore for quite a while, but I'm pleased that I've not been able to read any of his postings on this thread.
Please remember "Taking the knee is a political action, booing that action is not political. It's an entitlement of free speech"! Just one of the many gems I read before putting him back on ignore.
Pahahahaha Please remember "Taking the knee is a political action, booing that action is not political. It's an entitlement of free speech"! Just one of the many gems I read before putting him back on ignore.
Players stopping as a group before kick off to make political action = political action Thousands of random people dotted around the stadium, not organised, not there to make political points, respond = Not a political action
Not hard is it
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:33 - Jul 13 with 1557 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:52 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
It is tired shit. Is boring old narratives about England football fans, being used to stick the boot in on anyone and everyone who attends football.
Konk thought that bloke was a tw at. You don't. Fair enough.
Once again, it's not all England fans. It's just those that behave like t*ssers. It's quite simple.
And it's far more boring for those who have to watch them. Weirdly they seem to think it makes them seem more speshul and important. 🙄🙄🙄🙄. I'm amazed that anyone over 20 wants to defend them at all.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:35 - Jul 13 with 1518 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:04 - Jul 13 by daveB
To me I can't understand what makes someone want to send a message to a footballer or anyone really with the intent to abuse or belittle them, maybe it makes them feel better about themselves like a a school bully but it really has to stop.
Ultimately there is only so much social media companies can do, they need to do more but it really comes down to human decency and setting standards in society which comes from the top and I don't think either of the main two political parties in this country have covered themselves in glory with regard to racism and general verbal abuse in recent years. This has been turned into a left/right issue but it's just common human decency whatever party you vote for and we are miles away from it at the moment. I never knew or cared who my mates voted for but now whichever side you vote for you are called abusive names by the other. It's become a sport where your political party is now akin to your football team and you defend them at all costs even when they are in the wrong.
I completely agree with Gary Neville when he said a lot of this started again due to the way Brexit was debated with both sides very confrontational and abusive to each other and that has continued with every issue in society since. Until we get back to a time where people respect each other again this is only going to get worse. We've reached a stage now where footballers are saying they are making a protest before games to promote racial equality and it gets booed. Rather than understand and respect what they are doing even if you disagree with it people have to make their voices known to abuse a very simple protest which just creates even greater division. When the Prime Minister said it was OK to boo that gesture all bets were off as it was then open season to say what you want and you will always get absolute scumbags who take it too far and the leaders all row back in panic.
Fairly sure Milliband was getting dragged on Twitter for failing to eat a bacon sandwich long before Brexit
Likewise, there was the whole Millifandom thing that caught on, so social media should have been a massive advantage to left parties over the last 15 years. That Cameron vs Clegg vs Milliband was when practically the whole country joined twitter for the first time, I think. Sure everyone has deleted and restarted since then, though!
Twitter is responsible. Blaming politicians you don't like, or political decisions you don't like, is ridiculous.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:39 - Jul 13 with 1501 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:33 - Jul 13 by nix
Once again, it's not all England fans. It's just those that behave like t*ssers. It's quite simple.
And it's far more boring for those who have to watch them. Weirdly they seem to think it makes them seem more speshul and important. 🙄🙄🙄🙄. I'm amazed that anyone over 20 wants to defend them at all.
It's not though is it? The part of my post that you quoted did not mention "Not all" did it?
Just more bitterness from people who can't follow England away for whatever reason. Unlucky, lads. You dunno what you're missing out on.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:40 - Jul 13 with 1518 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:35 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
Fairly sure Milliband was getting dragged on Twitter for failing to eat a bacon sandwich long before Brexit
Likewise, there was the whole Millifandom thing that caught on, so social media should have been a massive advantage to left parties over the last 15 years. That Cameron vs Clegg vs Milliband was when practically the whole country joined twitter for the first time, I think. Sure everyone has deleted and restarted since then, though!
Twitter is responsible. Blaming politicians you don't like, or political decisions you don't like, is ridiculous.
wasn't quite saying online or any abuse didn't exist before 2016 just that it seems to have been amplified by leaders of all political parties since then
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:45 - Jul 13 with 1475 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:40 - Jul 13 by daveB
wasn't quite saying online or any abuse didn't exist before 2016 just that it seems to have been amplified by leaders of all political parties since then
Disagree Think this was Neville trying to shoehorn more politics into his football punditry I really liked Neville at the start but it's getting embarrassing now We get that he wants to be a man of the people, but we all know he lives on the top floor of the Hilton in Manchester and spends his money on building hotels with Giggsey.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:41 - Jul 13 with 1383 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:45 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
Disagree Think this was Neville trying to shoehorn more politics into his football punditry I really liked Neville at the start but it's getting embarrassing now We get that he wants to be a man of the people, but we all know he lives on the top floor of the Hilton in Manchester and spends his money on building hotels with Giggsey.
Why is it embarrassing that he expresses an opinion?
I don't buy this whole stick to football thing. None of us work or play professional football but we all talk about it and offer opinions, none of us are in government but we all comment on it so quite why sports people are so often told to shut up and stay out of it is beyond me.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:47 - Jul 13 with 1345 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:41 - Jul 13 by daveB
Why is it embarrassing that he expresses an opinion?
I don't buy this whole stick to football thing. None of us work or play professional football but we all talk about it and offer opinions, none of us are in government but we all comment on it so quite why sports people are so often told to shut up and stay out of it is beyond me.
Embarrassing because he's sat on Sky sports having a go at big clubs for trying to break away to form their own league
While being a Manchester United 'Class of 92 icon' who's working on sky sports.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:53 - Jul 13 with 1355 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:53 - Jul 13 by daveB
I don't get why that is embarrassing? You can be a Man Utd fan or icon whatever and still disagree with something your club does.
We both support QPR but sure we would both be very critical of the club if they did something like the super league
What, so you can't see any hypocrisy in Neville's position on that?
In that case, I haven't got much hope of you understanding any further examples. So I'll leave it.
Some further context. The England team were subjected to abusive tweets 2,114 times across three matches. 102 of them contained racism. About 30 Million in the UK watched the matches. So for every person, 0.00007047 abusive tweets per person. If we assume that all of those tweets originated from the UK, which they almost certainly did not.
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 19:47 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
Embarrassing because he's sat on Sky sports having a go at big clubs for trying to break away to form their own league
While being a Manchester United 'Class of 92 icon' who's working on sky sports.
He was an employee of the cub. He would have had no more of an influence over how the owners decided to become part of the Premiership than I would have had with my company recently deciding to sell 10% to a Chinese investment firm.
The fact he now works Sky Sports meant his comments were effectively critcising what they did in ‘92. Awkward. Sky could either ‘let him go’ (I doubt he’ll suffer financially) or not.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 21:48 - Jul 13 with 1177 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 21:34 - Jul 13 by Juzzie
He was an employee of the cub. He would have had no more of an influence over how the owners decided to become part of the Premiership than I would have had with my company recently deciding to sell 10% to a Chinese investment firm.
The fact he now works Sky Sports meant his comments were effectively critcising what they did in ‘92. Awkward. Sky could either ‘let him go’ (I doubt he’ll suffer financially) or not.
Well yeah, and isn't that just the elephant in the room throughout all of this. They're all massive hypocrites.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 22:09 - Jul 13 with 1139 views
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:39 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
It's not though is it? The part of my post that you quoted did not mention "Not all" did it?
Just more bitterness from people who can't follow England away for whatever reason. Unlucky, lads. You dunno what you're missing out on.
No, because you said England fans without a qualifier, so you did not specify that' it's only particular ones. I just put it right for you.
Bitterness? Hahahaha. Ok, then.
And I'm sure many England fans who go away have a brilliant time AND aren't obnoxious wan kers. You seem curiously wedded to supporting those that are 🤔.
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 22:09 - Jul 13 by nix
No, because you said England fans without a qualifier, so you did not specify that' it's only particular ones. I just put it right for you.
Bitterness? Hahahaha. Ok, then.
And I'm sure many England fans who go away have a brilliant time AND aren't obnoxious wan kers. You seem curiously wedded to supporting those that are 🤔.
England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 20:01 - Jul 13 by SheffieldHoop
What, so you can't see any hypocrisy in Neville's position on that?
In that case, I haven't got much hope of you understanding any further examples. So I'll leave it.
Some further context. The England team were subjected to abusive tweets 2,114 times across three matches. 102 of them contained racism. About 30 Million in the UK watched the matches. So for every person, 0.00007047 abusive tweets per person. If we assume that all of those tweets originated from the UK, which they almost certainly did not.
Can't believe this story is dominating the news. It's just weird.
A 16-year-old boy was murdered on the pavement in broad daylight in Thornton Heath this weekend. Seems like no one gives a shit.
[Post edited 13 Jul 2021 20:23]
I'm guessing you are saying as he works for Sky who pump a lot of money into the game and are seen as the bad guy he shouldn't have had a say on the super league? I can't agree on that to be honest. He wasn't the only pundit or presenter on Sky who were very much against the super league, whatever his job is he should be allowed an opinion on these kind of topics same as all of us, his job shouldn't and doesn't define his opinion.
On the other point, For me one racially abusive message to these players is too many and should be highlighted and people responsible shamed. No one has suggested the majority of England fans did this, of course it is a minority but that minority can't be allowed to grow
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