| No subject 18:55 - May 11 with 23441 views | nice_to_michu |
[Post edited 15 Nov 2017 11:47]
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:23 - May 18 with 2138 views | blueytheblue |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:21 - May 18 by trampie |
You said ''If Labour had half their manifesto as pictures, that was probably for the (g)nats to "read".''
So what nats would read a Labour manifesto ?, I would guess Brit Nats and Zionists ?, what nats were you referring to that would read a Labour manifesto ? |
(g)nats as in nationalists.
What on earth have Zionists got to do with it? |  |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:26 - May 18 with 2133 views | nice_to_michu |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:21 - May 18 by trampie |
You said ''If Labour had half their manifesto as pictures, that was probably for the (g)nats to "read".''
So what nats would read a Labour manifesto ?, I would guess Brit Nats and Zionists ?, what nats were you referring to that would read a Labour manifesto ? |
Ok, let's put an end to this whole "nats" nonsense, it's a topic you seem to be obsessed with and literally nobody on here agrees with you about it.
So, again I ask that since Labour had all of those pledges that you mentioned in their manifesto, aside from the investment committee thing, what exactly has Plaid won in this negotiation? | | | |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:32 - May 18 with 2125 views | exiledclaseboy |
The very least Wood should have got was a commitment to look at voting reform. The election result was way out of kilter with the proportion of votes cast and it needs looking at. The number of FPTP constituencies needs to be reduced, or even better get rid of the FPTP element altogether.
At least if they'd secured that, Wood's massive blunder by cosying up to the Tories and UKIP to try and coerce herself into government last week would have been worth something. As it is, a deal in which Labour has more or less only agreed to implement policies it was already committed to is no deal at all. |  |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:36 - May 18 with 2119 views | trampie |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:23 - May 18 by blueytheblue |
(g)nats as in nationalists.
What on earth have Zionists got to do with it? |
Zionists are Nats are they not ?, Brit Nats are Nats are they not ?, haven't Labour got some of each group in their ranks ?, friends of Israel types and GSTQ unionist types ? |  |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:38 - May 18 with 2110 views | nice_to_michu |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:32 - May 18 by exiledclaseboy |
The very least Wood should have got was a commitment to look at voting reform. The election result was way out of kilter with the proportion of votes cast and it needs looking at. The number of FPTP constituencies needs to be reduced, or even better get rid of the FPTP element altogether.
At least if they'd secured that, Wood's massive blunder by cosying up to the Tories and UKIP to try and coerce herself into government last week would have been worth something. As it is, a deal in which Labour has more or less only agreed to implement policies it was already committed to is no deal at all. |
Getting rid of FPTP constituencies altogether would just get rid of constituencies (e.g. Gower, Swansea East, Swansea West etc) and they would all just become "regions" (e.g, South West Wales) wouldn't it?
If that's the case then you would certainly have less accountability. There is less accountability in general with the list/regional AMs anyway.
Admittedly, I'm no expert on this I just can't see how else it would work. | | | |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:41 - May 18 with 2100 views | nice_to_michu |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:36 - May 18 by trampie |
Zionists are Nats are they not ?, Brit Nats are Nats are they not ?, haven't Labour got some of each group in their ranks ?, friends of Israel types and GSTQ unionist types ? |
Maybe they do, but it clearly doesn't define their ideology.
That is rather unlike another nationalist party I can think of called Plaid Cymru (aka The Party of Wales). You can't really get more nationalist than that, as proven by their willingness to do anything to get into power. No different to the Scottish nationalists. | | | |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:43 - May 18 with 2094 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:38 - May 18 by nice_to_michu |
Getting rid of FPTP constituencies altogether would just get rid of constituencies (e.g. Gower, Swansea East, Swansea West etc) and they would all just become "regions" (e.g, South West Wales) wouldn't it?
If that's the case then you would certainly have less accountability. There is less accountability in general with the list/regional AMs anyway.
Admittedly, I'm no expert on this I just can't see how else it would work. |
There are ways of making sure of proportionality while maintaining the local link, although no system is perfect Getting rid of constituencies is a step too far all at once perhaps but the boundaries certainly need looking at. The result of the election is in many ways worse than that worst vagaries of the Westminster FPTP fiasco due to the lower turnout. Whichever way you cut it, Labour winning just shy of half the seats on 35% of the votes cast isn't right. | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:47 - May 18 with 2088 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 16:56 - May 18 by trampie |
The camera went on the Labour faces they weren't laughing, they were like children been told off by their mam.
The Red Rhondda rebel will hold them to account, there is only so much she can do about the way people vote but she can still hold them to account. |
The "Red Rhondda Rebel" has bent over to kiss King Carwyn's arse and today she went back into mock "confrontational" mode.
Plaid have made the Lib Dems look like a savage negotiating force and Nick Clegg look like Margaret Thatcher FFS.
How can you even come on here with your "Brit Nationalists" insults when you're leader's head has just popped up from under smug Carwyn's desk? Unbelievable!!!
Plaid Cymru - Untrustworthy and unelectable |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:51 - May 18 with 2075 views | trampie |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:47 - May 18 by Brynmill_Jack |
The "Red Rhondda Rebel" has bent over to kiss King Carwyn's arse and today she went back into mock "confrontational" mode.
Plaid have made the Lib Dems look like a savage negotiating force and Nick Clegg look like Margaret Thatcher FFS.
How can you even come on here with your "Brit Nationalists" insults when you're leader's head has just popped up from under smug Carwyn's desk? Unbelievable!!!
Plaid Cymru - Untrustworthy and unelectable |
So you think using the term Welsh nationalist or nationalist is insulting ? | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:56 - May 18 with 2066 views | blueytheblue |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:36 - May 18 by trampie |
Zionists are Nats are they not ?, Brit Nats are Nats are they not ?, haven't Labour got some of each group in their ranks ?, friends of Israel types and GSTQ unionist types ? |
Well you didn't mention British Nats, did you?
I don't even think you know what your point is. | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:01 - May 18 with 2038 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:51 - May 18 by trampie |
So you think using the term Welsh nationalist or nationalist is insulting ? |
No, Brit nationalist was the term you used towards Labour................................. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:03 - May 18 with 2036 views | trampie |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:01 - May 18 by Brynmill_Jack |
No, Brit nationalist was the term you used towards Labour................................. |
So you think the phrase Brit Nat is insulting but Welsh Nat is not ?  | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:09 - May 18 with 2024 views | trampie |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:56 - May 18 by blueytheblue |
Well you didn't mention British Nats, did you?
I don't even think you know what your point is. |
You said ''If Labour had half their manifesto as pictures, that was probably for the (g)nats to "read".''
And I said ''Are you claiming Brit Nats and Zionists can't read ?''
So what Nats are you talking about that would be trying to read a Labour manifesto ? | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:10 - May 18 with 2019 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:03 - May 18 by trampie |
So you think the phrase Brit Nat is insulting but Welsh Nat is not ? |
I don't find the term Welsh Nationalist insulting in the slightest. But your use of the term "Brit Nationalist" seems derogatory as if only Plaid ave the interests of Wales at heart.
They are mostly all Welsh nationals, are they not? | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:14 - May 18 with 2009 views | trampie |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:10 - May 18 by Brynmill_Jack |
I don't find the term Welsh Nationalist insulting in the slightest. But your use of the term "Brit Nationalist" seems derogatory as if only Plaid ave the interests of Wales at heart.
They are mostly all Welsh nationals, are they not? |
Why do you think Brit Nat is insulting and Welsh Nat is not ?, you are making a distinction when there isn't one, either both terms are insulting or neither. | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:35 - May 18 with 1988 views | nice_to_michu |
Trampie which parts of the deal today that Plaid are so proud of were not in Labour's manifesto?
I'm intrigued.
One of the five "major victories" (a quote from Plaid's spokesperson) is for the Welsh Government to "campaign vociferously for "remain" vote".
Genuinely, how desperate does a party have to be to highlight a campaign to remain in the EU (something Welsh Labour already support) as one of your five major victories from the past week?
I would say it's unbelievable, but it's totally believable given the characters in this embarrassing story. | | | |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 22:17 - May 18 with 1924 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:35 - May 18 by nice_to_michu |
Trampie which parts of the deal today that Plaid are so proud of were not in Labour's manifesto?
I'm intrigued.
One of the five "major victories" (a quote from Plaid's spokesperson) is for the Welsh Government to "campaign vociferously for "remain" vote".
Genuinely, how desperate does a party have to be to highlight a campaign to remain in the EU (something Welsh Labour already support) as one of your five major victories from the past week?
I would say it's unbelievable, but it's totally believable given the characters in this embarrassing story. |
Leanne has style. Plaid has swagger. Times are achanging.
The Red Republican Rhondda Rebel is shaking the smug buggers up. Good. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 22:22 - May 18 with 1916 views | nice_to_michu |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 22:17 - May 18 by Kilkennyjack |
Leanne has style. Plaid has swagger. Times are achanging.
The Red Republican Rhondda Rebel is shaking the smug buggers up. Good. |
What has that got to do with what I said?
Plaid state that a major victory of theirs today is a "vociferous campaign to remain" in the EU, and Labour already support that.
It's desperate. You know it, I know it. [Post edited 18 May 2016 22:22]
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 23:10 - May 18 with 1883 views | Cottsy |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:36 - May 18 by trampie |
Zionists are Nats are they not ?, Brit Nats are Nats are they not ?, haven't Labour got some of each group in their ranks ?, friends of Israel types and GSTQ unionist types ? |
Fair play Tramps only you could accuse Labour of being a Zionist party while they are holding an inquiry into whether there is an institutional antisemitism problem within party. |  |
| If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys? |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 23:15 - May 18 with 1878 views | blueytheblue |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 22:17 - May 18 by Kilkennyjack |
Leanne has style. Plaid has swagger. Times are achanging.
The Red Republican Rhondda Rebel is shaking the smug buggers up. Good. |
Style. Swagger. Times achanging.
Yet couldn't get a majority in the WAG despite a poor incumbent Labour, despite the rising popularity for nationalism as seen by the SNP in Jockland... | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 23:17 - May 18 with 1877 views | Kerouac |
Tramp, nobody wants to have sex with you mate. |  |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 15:37 - May 19 with 1805 views | Uxbridge |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 16:50 - May 17 by londonlisa2001 |
Apart from the only reason they actually didn't win is because the Lib Dem refused to play along.
If she had done then they would have won the vote - it's as simple as that. And they would have won a vote with the only mechanism available to them at that point to have Tories / UKIP support and even cabinet positions.
I just don't believe them that it was all such a surprise when every other leader has categorically stated that they were approached and talks were being held. Even Kirsty Williams described it as a rag tail coalition involving UKIP. Interesting use of the word coalition if nothing was planned. |
Even the unprincipled Liberals wouldn't get into bed with UKIP. It was never happening. |  |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 15:39 - May 19 with 1802 views | Uxbridge |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:28 - May 17 by exiledclaseboy |
The vote finished 29-29. It was only Kirsty Williams that stopped Leanne Wood forming some kind of Frankenstein administration. You reckon they knew that Williams would vote in that way and went ahead with the vote on that basis to give Labour a "bloody nose"?
Pull the other one, Ux. It's got Dafydd Wigley on. |
You really think there was the remotest prospect of Williams voting for UKIP? Have a word mun.
Not entirely convinced Wood used the victory to force through anything of note though. Shame. | |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:37 - May 19 with 1760 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 20:14 - May 18 by trampie |
Why do you think Brit Nat is insulting and Welsh Nat is not ?, you are making a distinction when there isn't one, either both terms are insulting or neither. |
You're the only one using the term to bash any Welsh politician outside of plaid Cymru. Are you so desperately ashamed of the way plaid sold out to the "Brit Nat's" as you call them you're trying to blank it out by arguing with me lol? | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 19:58 - May 19 with 1746 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Plaid do a deal with UKIP and the Tories on 15:39 - May 19 by Uxbridge |
You really think there was the remotest prospect of Williams voting for UKIP? Have a word mun.
Not entirely convinced Wood used the victory to force through anything of note though. Shame. |
She didn't need to vote for UKIP. If Williams had abstained the UKIP/PLaid/Tory alliance wins the vote and Wood is First Minister. Then what happens? That's the question no one who thinks that Wood's shenanigans were just a harmless wheeze is prepared to answer | |
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