| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays 15:13 - Dec 7 with 35914 views | Plazex |
Actually looks as if Sakho took fabianski down. Hope we have the card rescinded. And bloody hell 3-1 crap. |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:46 - Dec 7 with 1855 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:43 - Dec 7 by C_jack |
If there's no handball then there's nothing, no goalscoring opportunity, just a big ol heap of Williams, Sakho and Fabianski.
The only part of his body that he can knock it past Fabianski with is his hand. He can't raise his foot that high and he's never putting his head down that low knowing what's coming.
It's the game's equivalent of entrapment, you can't foul to get another player to foul you. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 20:44]
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Please read the last line of ECB's well written post, its the line ive repeated countless times and is amazingly the one that keeps getting overlooked.
1) Sakhos foul was not seen, it now cannot be reviewed.
2) Fabianskis foul was seen, as it resulted in a red it CAN be reviewed.
If your reasoning for the reversing of decision 2 is the handball, then please re-read number 1.
As for your last comment, he didnt get Fabianski to foul him, he still didnt have to do it. And yes you can foul another to foul you. People often niggle at barton to get him to react. If he does then hes off regardless what the other player did first. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 20:48]
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:53 - Dec 7 with 1823 views | C_jack |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:46 - Dec 7 by Parlay |
Please read the last line of ECB's well written post, its the line ive repeated countless times and is amazingly the one that keeps getting overlooked.
1) Sakhos foul was not seen, it now cannot be reviewed.
2) Fabianskis foul was seen, as it resulted in a red it CAN be reviewed.
If your reasoning for the reversing of decision 2 is the handball, then please re-read number 1.
As for your last comment, he didnt get Fabianski to foul him, he still didnt have to do it. And yes you can foul another to foul you. People often niggle at barton to get him to react. If he does then hes off regardless what the other player did first. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 20:48]
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A contributes to B. The whole passage of play should/hopefully will be reviewed, of which Mark Halsey has already alluded to. |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:56 - Dec 7 with 1801 views | monmouth |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:38 - Dec 7 by exiledclaseboy |
I haven't read all of this thread by any means but isn't the relevant question whether the ref would have pulled play back and disallowed the goal had Sakho's shot gone in? If the answer is no, then it's clear that no goalscoring opportunity was denied and the red card should be rescinded. If Foy says yes (which he will and Sky's enhanced audio showing him blowing the whistle before Sakho's attempt on goal will support him in that) then there are no grounds for appeal. If we appeal, which I think we will, we'll lose.
The handball is irrelevant. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 20:41]
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I have no idea what will or should happen but, given that he did go on and clearly did have a goalscoring opportunity (before Foy chose to blow up) then how in the name of all that's holy can a goalscoring opportunity have been denied? (the laws don't say a BETTER goalscoring opportunity do they?
I think we will appeal, and I don't think that it's clear cut either way. Halsey says we'll win, Dean says we'll lose. I think we'll roll the dice. |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:00 - Dec 7 with 1769 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:53 - Dec 7 by C_jack |
A contributes to B. The whole passage of play should/hopefully will be reviewed, of which Mark Halsey has already alluded to. |
Mark Halsey is incorrect, it will not be taken into account what so ever. | |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:03 - Dec 7 with 1753 views | LeonisGod |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:53 - Dec 7 by C_jack |
A contributes to B. The whole passage of play should/hopefully will be reviewed, of which Mark Halsey has already alluded to. |
Is this still rumbling on? I suspect you are correct. If they review the incident and see that Foy mistakenly thought Sahko has legitimately nicked the ball past Fab, then we do stand a chance of a successful appeal. If he doesn't do that then the whole situation is different. But none of us know how this will go (or even if we'll appeal) so we'll just have to wait and see. |  | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:07 - Dec 7 with 1730 views | Brynmill_Jack |
Why are people still arguing with him? People, he's taking the f*cking p*ss! Step back from your keyboards and put the kettle on FFS ! |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:08 - Dec 7 with 1726 views | Darran |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:07 - Dec 7 by Brynmill_Jack |
Why are people still arguing with him? People, he's taking the f*cking p*ss! Step back from your keyboards and put the kettle on FFS ! |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:09 - Dec 7 with 1725 views | C_jack |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:03 - Dec 7 by LeonisGod |
Is this still rumbling on? I suspect you are correct. If they review the incident and see that Foy mistakenly thought Sahko has legitimately nicked the ball past Fab, then we do stand a chance of a successful appeal. If he doesn't do that then the whole situation is different. But none of us know how this will go (or even if we'll appeal) so we'll just have to wait and see. |
In whatever footage they use to make their decision, it's there, in plain bloomin sight, I fail to see how they can ignore it, when it's the catalyst for everything that happens in the following events.
Can someone please phone Matt the Jack. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 21:18]
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:13 - Dec 7 with 1696 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:07 - Dec 7 by Brynmill_Jack |
Why are people still arguing with him? People, he's taking the f*cking p*ss! Step back from your keyboards and put the kettle on FFS ! |
Because people like to try and challenge people who are traditionally right. I cannot help i am traditionally right and thus cannot help peoples need to engage. Amazing talent though to read messages from people you claim to ignore and also more amazing is you want to talk about someone you have actively restricted yourself from noticing.
Very odd.
You still cant review a not given hand ball though. | |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:13 - Dec 7 with 1695 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:08 - Dec 7 by Darran |
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I'm grateful I haven't seem either the game OR this poxy incident! | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:15 - Dec 7 with 1681 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:13 - Dec 7 by Brynmill_Jack |
I'm grateful I haven't seem either the game OR this poxy incident! |
Thought you were a fan? | |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:19 - Dec 7 with 1656 views | NeathJack |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:13 - Dec 7 by Parlay |
Because people like to try and challenge people who are traditionally right. I cannot help i am traditionally right and thus cannot help peoples need to engage. Amazing talent though to read messages from people you claim to ignore and also more amazing is you want to talk about someone you have actively restricted yourself from noticing.
Very odd.
You still cant review a not given hand ball though. |
This is what the Americans would call a "bang bang play". The two incidents are so close together and inextricably linked to each other I would be amazed if the handball wasn't taken into consideration.
I have seen no evidence or link to suggest it wouldn't be. |  | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:20 - Dec 7 with 1653 views | waynekerr55 |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:34 - Dec 7 by jackonicko |
If you insist on being so literal on the rules, Parlay, then the words of Law 12 are very clear. The red card is for denying a clear goal scoring opportunity. There is no distinction between a clearer or better goal scoring opportunity. It's binary.
He had a clear opportunity. He therefore wasn't denied. Therefore, it is more than fair to argue not a red card. |
I was going to post something similar. We 'should' have a strong case, whether we do or not is debatable. |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:20 - Dec 7 with 1652 views | LeonisGod |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:56 - Dec 7 by monmouth |
I have no idea what will or should happen but, given that he did go on and clearly did have a goalscoring opportunity (before Foy chose to blow up) then how in the name of all that's holy can a goalscoring opportunity have been denied? (the laws don't say a BETTER goalscoring opportunity do they?
I think we will appeal, and I don't think that it's clear cut either way. Halsey says we'll win, Dean says we'll lose. I think we'll roll the dice. |
Sahko stayed on his feet and had a free shot at an open goal, which the ref then denied by blowing up. I'd have loved to see Sahko's shot go in - the place would have gone nuts when they found out it didn't count. A bizarre time to blow up when you think about it. Too late for an immediate foul, but then once Sahko rode the tackle Foy had to let that advantage play through. | | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:24 - Dec 7 with 1628 views | LeonisGod |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:07 - Dec 7 by Brynmill_Jack |
Why are people still arguing with him? People, he's taking the f*cking p*ss! Step back from your keyboards and put the kettle on FFS ! |
What?! You mean he's NOT better informed, experienced or qualified than Mark Halsey. Damn, I thought we had a genius in our midst  | | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:30 - Dec 7 with 1605 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:19 - Dec 7 by NeathJack |
This is what the Americans would call a "bang bang play". The two incidents are so close together and inextricably linked to each other I would be amazed if the handball wasn't taken into consideration.
I have seen no evidence or link to suggest it wouldn't be. |
Its not related at all. You are of course referring to the NFL which has completely different rules of the game not to mention review criteria.
The handball is irrelevant, i cannot stress this enough. | |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:33 - Dec 7 with 1592 views | jack_lord |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 16:01 - Dec 7 by londonlisa2001 |
on what basis would you have sent him off?
Irrespective of the obvious handball, there is no obligation whatsoever on a player to get out of the way if a player just runs into him which is what happened.
Fabianski didn't put his hands out, he didn't jump into him - he went out and blocked the angle which he is perfectly entitled to do. Sakho ran into him (actually with a slight push from Williams). The only reason it looked like a foul was the handball. The only possible foul was against Ash for the push - possible yellow card. The decision was incorrect.
We'll appeal that and it will get overturned, again! And we'll still have lost a chance at a point because of it.
Dear God - that was up there with the most biased commentary and match build up I have ever seen (including the BT coverage of the Man Utd match) and even they thought it wasn't a sending off, and yet we have so called Swans fans falling over themselves to justify another shocking decision because it fits with some sort of warped agenda. |
I was thinking that at the time. I wondered why the commentators didn't once mention it. If anything, Ash shouldered him into Fab who was under no obligation to get out of his way? |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:34 - Dec 7 with 1585 views | ScoobyWho |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 20:46 - Dec 7 by Parlay |
Please read the last line of ECB's well written post, its the line ive repeated countless times and is amazingly the one that keeps getting overlooked.
1) Sakhos foul was not seen, it now cannot be reviewed.
2) Fabianskis foul was seen, as it resulted in a red it CAN be reviewed.
If your reasoning for the reversing of decision 2 is the handball, then please re-read number 1.
As for your last comment, he didnt get Fabianski to foul him, he still didnt have to do it. And yes you can foul another to foul you. People often niggle at barton to get him to react. If he does then hes off regardless what the other player did first. [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 20:48]
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Parlay, I thought it was the other way round - If a foul was not seen it CAN be reviewed, if it was seen it cannot be. |  |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:35 - Dec 7 with 1582 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:28 - Dec 7 by Parlay |
Thats an odd opinion. I always find it strange when people take that cheap route out of a debate. Doesnt anyone who disagrees with me then think they know more than Phil Dowd and the current Premier League ref that made the decision?
If Jose Mourinho likes Torres and Alex Ferguson doesn't rate him... Yet i also have the opinion he isn't very good. Does that mean i am claiming i know more about football than mourinho? What about the people that rate him? Does that mean they think they know more than Sir Alex? Or does that mean because we are not employed in the industry even though some of us have 50 years experience our opinions count for nothing?
Ah well close the board down now, we are doomed.
(P.s. When i get shown to be correct, can i then claim i am a genius and know more than Halsey?) [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 21:31]
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bloody hell - 50 plus?? I assumed to be honest that you were a teenager - 50 plus and you're wanting to 'bet' with everyone.
Good God alive - what chance have we got. | | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:36 - Dec 7 with 1578 views | somersetsimon |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:03 - Dec 7 by LeonisGod |
Is this still rumbling on? I suspect you are correct. If they review the incident and see that Foy mistakenly thought Sahko has legitimately nicked the ball past Fab, then we do stand a chance of a successful appeal. If he doesn't do that then the whole situation is different. But none of us know how this will go (or even if we'll appeal) so we'll just have to wait and see. |
The referee may say that he saw the handball and reckoned it was accidental. In which case, we forget that part in the appeal.
If the referee would have called that as handball, if he'd seen it, I can't see why it should be considered irrelevant because it hadn't been spotted. Imagine a different case where a defender comes in to make a fair tackle. The attacker moves the ball out of the way with his hand (unseen by the referee). This causes the defender to kick the player instead of the ball and is sent off. How can an unseen offence which contributes to the penalized offence be ignored.
In any case, I think the better appeal is on the grounds that Sakho was so wide (even without the contact), that it wasn't a clear opportunity. |  | | |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:38 - Dec 7 with 1569 views | Parlay |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:35 - Dec 7 by londonlisa2001 |
bloody hell - 50 plus?? I assumed to be honest that you were a teenager - 50 plus and you're wanting to 'bet' with everyone.
Good God alive - what chance have we got. |
I didn't say i had 50 years experience. I said some of us do. But nice of you to enter with another irony laced playground rant when of course you refused to answer probing on topic questions and points which made your opinion look silly.
This is the only issue with females on the board whether its time of the month (dont know if you have had them or they are long gone) or just hormones in general. You have gone from someone who seemed quite sensible to an absolute foaming at the mouth buffoon.
No offence intended but take a step back here, take a look at your posts and above all... calm down.
(By the way what is it with you and betting? The average punter is a grown man by definition. Have a think) [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 21:41]
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:43 - Dec 7 with 1537 views | ScoobyWho |
In the case of a red card, if the ref thought an incident happened and it turns out later it didn't the red card can be rescinded. We are over complicating matters here. What seems to be misunderstood is the ruling whereby a ref if he see's something and deals with it then it cant be dealt with later. In the case of a red this doesn't apply. It doesn't matter if he saw it or not when a red card appeal is underway.
That rule is for things that go unpunished during the game, not for things that have already been punished and that are under appeal. It's different. | |
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| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:46 - Dec 7 with 1525 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Fabianski red card-Seen the replays on 21:38 - Dec 7 by Parlay |
I didn't say i had 50 years experience. I said some of us do. But nice of you to enter with another irony laced playground rant when of course you refused to answer probing on topic questions and points which made your opinion look silly.
This is the only issue with females on the board whether its time of the month (dont know if you have had them or they are long gone) or just hormones in general. You have gone from someone who seemed quite sensible to an absolute foaming at the mouth buffoon.
No offence intended but take a step back here, take a look at your posts and above all... calm down.
(By the way what is it with you and betting? The average punter is a grown man by definition. Have a think) [Post edited 7 Dec 2014 21:41]
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ha ha ha.
So you have an issue with females. I can't say I'm surprised - I can't imagine you've had much experience with them in real life.
Nothing with me and betting - I just didn't want to bet with you. Largely to be completely honest, because nothing you could bet would give me the slightest interest in whether I won the bet or not. | | | |
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