| QPR Finances released 06:25 - Feb 28 with 58797 views | Jeff |
From Kieran Maguire in the Twitter:
[Post edited 28 Feb 2023 6:29]
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| QPR Finances released on 08:50 - Feb 28 with 3491 views | Northernr |
| QPR Finances released on 08:38 - Feb 28 by baz_qpr |
You have to take the £8m for the training ground out as its an asset and does not count towards FPP so its a £16m loss in the grand scheme of things which is still high and gives us only 10m or so headroom on the FPP so we absolutely need a player sale this summer but all the sellable assets are crocked or have had a dramatic loss of form. |
Other way round mate I think, you have to add it on not take it away. |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 08:54 - Feb 28 with 3467 views | CroydonCaptJack |
Are there any football clubs in this division who make a profit? Serious question as it seems we hear of these horrific losses from the likes of Brum, Reading etc as well. |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 08:58 - Feb 28 with 3431 views | daveB |
Covid and the transfer market collapsing has done us at the worst possible time. 3/4 years ago we'd have got decent money for Willock or Dieng last summer, not a thing now and that's where the gamble has spectacularly failed
Unless the rules change we'll be facing a points deduction this time next year |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:02 - Feb 28 with 3412 views | wombat |
| QPR Finances released on 08:58 - Feb 28 by daveB |
Covid and the transfer market collapsing has done us at the worst possible time. 3/4 years ago we'd have got decent money for Willock or Dieng last summer, not a thing now and that's where the gamble has spectacularly failed
Unless the rules change we'll be facing a points deduction this time next year |
and some reckon because we are a london club we would have loads of offers to buy us ,
yeah cant see that happening |  |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:04 - Feb 28 with 3392 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| QPR Finances released on 08:03 - Feb 28 by DejR_vu |
A third of a billion, to go from a Prem club to where we are now. And that’s losses, not expenditure. We must have spent close to half a billion.
The owners are at least sticking around, so deserve massive credit for that, but they did create this sh1t show. I don’t know whether to be grateful or angry. They’ve destroyed the club to the point where we are entirely reliant on them for survival.
At least we’re punching above our weight on the pitch  |
If only it were a third of a billion!
Maybe my crude maths is wrong, but I've been working on the basis of £500m.
We incurred as I recall, around £240m in debt. Added to the income generated from two promotions, three years in the Prem and three parachute payments, I estimated this was around £250m.
Squandered, with absolutely effing nothing to show for it. Diddly bloody squat off the field, and precious little on it.
As I and numerous others have been saying for years, it needs a proper root and branch culling from the top down. |  |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:09 - Feb 28 with 3330 views | Hunterhoop |
| QPR Finances released on 08:13 - Feb 28 by DejR_vu |
Surely the bigger picture here is the lack of revenue. We’re a football club. We partake in a competition every year. We can’t just hope to survive every year. If we look good for a promotion push, surely you have to back it, to a point. We didn’t give Warburton a £50m war chest.
The problem is we‘ve got decent money for one player in 10 f@cking years. If we were even mildly competent in that area we wouldn’t be in this bloody mess. |
Obviously the lack of player sales and revenue is an issue. But the point still stands that we let Warburton operate at a 24m loss in that season. No player sales were forced on him - as they need to be under these FFP constraints, and he was actually given what he asked for in terms of Johansen, Gray, etc, which he shouldn’t have been. Since the parachute payments fell out tha was our biggest loss season. It’s a failure from Hoos, no doubt. I was just making the point that Warburton was backed heavily (for us, with our finances). The gamble was to go up and we did not.
Anyway, looking forward, we have now breached FFP, to a relatively small degree and might get away with a small fine for now. But come 2025 when we produce our results for 2023/24 season (next season) we are going to be given a whopper (12 points minimum), unless we sell everything but the kitchen sink this summer. And if we do that we’ll go down anyway.
Happy Tuesday everyone. [Post edited 28 Feb 2023 9:28]
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| QPR Finances released on 09:09 - Feb 28 with 3331 views | loftus77 |
So, basically we'll be a League Two club in August 2024 then? That's all I can gather, that's all I understand, that's all (to me) that kind of matters. |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:12 - Feb 28 with 3302 views | ngbqpr |
In addition to covid / the changes in the transfer market for Champ players Clive has detailed many times, it was 2021's form that did us in - "promotion if it was a calendar year."
The powers that be looked at the second half of the 20-21 season, and like so many football club owners who make irrational decisions they wouldn't make in their day to day businesses, took the gamble - sign the 4 loanees, and hey presto!
If it were that easy, everyone would be doing it. |  |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:14 - Feb 28 with 3286 views | BAWHoops |
So glad the board made the decision to 'keep the band together' this season and not aggressively try and sell one of our assets |  |
| http://blogandwhitehoops.wordpress.com/ |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:16 - Feb 28 with 3266 views | stantheman10 |
| QPR Finances released on 08:03 - Feb 28 by dmm |
This looks terrible. Gnanalingam and Bhatia must have known about this when they did their interview just a few days ago but they chose not to address it in any way. Surely the club needs to make a statement? |
What statement are they going to make? 'We're skint'?
Be thankful they're are still interested because if they aren't then we are in trouble! | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:17 - Feb 28 with 3262 views | Rangersw12 |
Can't really blame the manager or any previous managers as they all want more players etc
Blame firmly lines with the CEO and DOF who shouldn't be allowing this to happen
Club is proper fcked and we need a massive shake up in the summer and every position needs to be reviewed
40 more staff than Millwall is embarrassing | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:17 - Feb 28 with 3263 views | toboboly |
I know we all rate Willock, Chair, and Dieng but even before their injuries/the current abyssal plunge there was little to no interest in any of them when we were carving through the league like butter.
Whilst taking into account the lack of mid level Championship purchases since covid it makes you wonder why, what are other clubs seeing or hearing that means they won't even bid/enquire? |  |
| Sexy Asian dwarves wanted. |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:19 - Feb 28 with 3238 views | DejR_vu |
| QPR Finances released on 09:09 - Feb 28 by Hunterhoop |
Obviously the lack of player sales and revenue is an issue. But the point still stands that we let Warburton operate at a 24m loss in that season. No player sales were forced on him - as they need to be under these FFP constraints, and he was actually given what he asked for in terms of Johansen, Gray, etc, which he shouldn’t have been. Since the parachute payments fell out tha was our biggest loss season. It’s a failure from Hoos, no doubt. I was just making the point that Warburton was backed heavily (for us, with our finances). The gamble was to go up and we did not.
Anyway, looking forward, we have now breached FFP, to a relatively small degree and might get away with a small fine for now. But come 2025 when we produce our results for 2023/24 season (next season) we are going to be given a whopper (12 points minimum), unless we sell everything but the kitchen sink this summer. And if we do that we’ll go down anyway.
Happy Tuesday everyone. [Post edited 28 Feb 2023 9:28]
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This football club should have a health warning on its shirts instead of a sponsor. It’s supposed to be something pleasurable to distract from all the other cr@p, but it makes it worse. | |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:24 - Feb 28 with 3221 views | Hunterhoop |
| QPR Finances released on 08:58 - Feb 28 by daveB |
Covid and the transfer market collapsing has done us at the worst possible time. 3/4 years ago we'd have got decent money for Willock or Dieng last summer, not a thing now and that's where the gamble has spectacularly failed
Unless the rules change we'll be facing a points deduction this time next year |
Dave, the big points deduction will come in 2025.
For the last 3 years (19/20, 20/21, 21/22), we have come in at 45m operating loss. 6m over the threshold, but there might be leeway for the pandemic.
This season (22/23) you’d hope expect our operating loss to be lower as we have fewer staff and have let go some big earners. Beale income vs Critchley’s payoff probably offsets. But I won’t be much lower. Let’s say 20m loss.
So that will move us to 49m, possibly with some pandemic allowance, maybe a fine/suspended points deduction.
But 23/24 (next season) is the problem. Without a big player sale, or lots of sales, we’ll lose another 20m+. The 4m loss year drops out of the rolling period, and suddenly we’re 24m loss, 20m loss, 20m loss. So 64m in 3 years all of which are post pandemic.
Then the hammer will fall. | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:26 - Feb 28 with 3200 views | Hunterhoop |
| QPR Finances released on 09:09 - Feb 28 by loftus77 |
So, basically we'll be a League Two club in August 2024 then? That's all I can gather, that's all I understand, that's all (to me) that kind of matters. |
August 2025, we’ll have a massive points deduction to start the season, hopefully in the Champ.
I think the EFL won’t deduct is for a 6m breach (now) and a 10m breach (published Spring 2024), but they bloody well will for a 25m breach come Spring 2025, especially given the previous two years’ breaches! | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:32 - Feb 28 with 3150 views | Gloucs_R |
How do the finances compare to Millwall?
Both similar size London clubs. |  |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:34 - Feb 28 with 3142 views | daveB |
| QPR Finances released on 09:24 - Feb 28 by Hunterhoop |
Dave, the big points deduction will come in 2025.
For the last 3 years (19/20, 20/21, 21/22), we have come in at 45m operating loss. 6m over the threshold, but there might be leeway for the pandemic.
This season (22/23) you’d hope expect our operating loss to be lower as we have fewer staff and have let go some big earners. Beale income vs Critchley’s payoff probably offsets. But I won’t be much lower. Let’s say 20m loss.
So that will move us to 49m, possibly with some pandemic allowance, maybe a fine/suspended points deduction.
But 23/24 (next season) is the problem. Without a big player sale, or lots of sales, we’ll lose another 20m+. The 4m loss year drops out of the rolling period, and suddenly we’re 24m loss, 20m loss, 20m loss. So 64m in 3 years all of which are post pandemic.
Then the hammer will fall. |
yeah that sounds as bleak as I thought | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:36 - Feb 28 with 3130 views | MelakaRanger |
Players , Managers, Coaches increased from 113 to 136 in just 12 months. 23 extra! They cost on average £176,000 each per year.
So 23 extra at average of £176k = extra cost of £4million 1 Why do we need 23 more?
We seriously need to cut our cloth. And the whole of the Football League needs to re-evaluate the wages paid to players. There will be a number of our players on £10k or more per week. Who if anyone at QPR is worth paying half a million £s a year for?
Since Sky/Premiership came along 30 years ago the wages of players have lost all sence of reality - even more so in the Premiership.
But down here in the 'real world' the whole Football league needs to get real. How can any business pay out more than its income on wages along? Any normal business would go bust.
Rubens main business in Malaysia would never allow wages to get anywhere near income, like I say it would go bust. So why do Football clubs get treated differently? Why do (it appears) the majority of fans of clubs not 'get it'.
I think that FFP should be even more severe. On a rolling 3 years why shouldnt it be a zero loss?
And surely QPR cannot need even 113 players coaches and managers?
If we had say 80 in total (an arbitary figure) and the average annual wage was £120K (still a massive wage in the real world, our wages bill would only - yes only - be around 10 million. Nearly 15 million less that last years bill.
I love QPR. I've supported them since 1967. Football needs to take a reality check. Clubs are a business and if you keep making losses you should go bust |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:37 - Feb 28 with 3128 views | monners1969 |
Have been waiting behind the Sofa for the latest set of results. It sort of explains why Hoos was so defensive in recent interviews.
First up if QPR were just a business the owners would just sell the assets the club has and stop operating. Day to Day we are setting fire to money, there are only 3 real ways out of it...
1. Asset sales - apart from the ground this is obivously just players. and we've been ridiculously unlucky on Willock Chair and Dieng either falling off a cliff form wise or picking up way too many injuries. I cant really see any other sellable assets, which makes my frustration at our Loan strategy even higher. We have to be developing players we own not others FFS.
2. Develop other sources of income. We're stuck in the ground currently - no real scope of this changing over the next 10 years... so what else can we use LR for? concerts? Shared tenancy (Wasps are homeless again, Ealing RFC have aspirations for Prem Rugby but ground too small) NFL wouldnt train on our pitches... I cant really think of other options?
3.Promotion to Prem - more chances of 1 and 2 happening currently
So I think whether we survice this season or not we are circiling the L1 drain. Time to plan for it. No more loans use the players we own in a quicker contract cycle (1 renewal allowed for each player then ditch or invest IF theyve got to the magic 50 appearances mark) rinse repeat.
In the shorter term I'd love to know in all the people we employ do we have a sports Phsycologist? Because if we dont thats something we desperately need and if we do they need sacking and replacing.
Whilst L1 would be even more of a financial debacle I think its coming in the next 2-3 seasons... we are so badly prepared its frightneing |  | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:39 - Feb 28 with 3108 views | ted_hendrix |
How strange the world of football has become, all I can think about Is Saturday's game and not losing at Rotherham, what I wouldn't give for a clean sheet on Saturday.
But no here we go again I've now got something else to think and worry about this morning and that something else Is QPR's finances.
Jesus bloody wept am I going bloody mad? I'm sure or at least I think I'm sure that about a Month ago our stinky neighbours down the road broke the transfer record for buying a player whom I had never heard of, I'm sure the player cost our stinky neighbours over a hundred Million Pounds, I'm not really bothered about our stinky neighbours but I'm seriously bothered about our game and It's result on Saturday and that's the problem for me.
A simple hop on the bus or the train from Shepherd's Bush and depending on traffic you can be at our stinky neighbours ground in no time at all, these same stinky neighbours who have so much money whereas we have so little money and by the look of It and unless I really am going mad we are pretty soon about to be fined money that we don't have and have points that we don't have deducted.
Bloody hell, why can't they leave things alone and let people go and watch football on a Saturday afternoon or a Wednesday evening like we used to and let people like me worry or look forward to our next fixture?
If Rotherham score three goals on Saturday I will explode, literally bloody explode.
Three at the back anybody?
Goodbye. |  |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| QPR Finances released on 09:44 - Feb 28 with 3027 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| QPR Finances released on 09:09 - Feb 28 by loftus77 |
So, basically we'll be a League Two club in August 2024 then? That's all I can gather, that's all I understand, that's all (to me) that kind of matters. |
On the positive side, we might win the odd game. | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:49 - Feb 28 with 2964 views | Pikey |
Not going to comment on the accounts until someone who fully understands them posts a definitive view.
But I am amused that most postings blame Les and Hoos for not selling our best players and for over investing in others.
I'm sure I read on another string that Les and Hoos were to blame for us not keeping our best players and not signing anyone decent.
Ah well the life of a football fan. | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:51 - Feb 28 with 2944 views | Northernr |
| QPR Finances released on 09:49 - Feb 28 by Pikey |
Not going to comment on the accounts until someone who fully understands them posts a definitive view.
But I am amused that most postings blame Les and Hoos for not selling our best players and for over investing in others.
I'm sure I read on another string that Les and Hoos were to blame for us not keeping our best players and not signing anyone decent.
Ah well the life of a football fan. |
I would say a £24m loss in a single season, spending £1.24 on wages for ever £1 you bring in, allowing your staff to balloon to nearly 200 people at an average salary of £176,000 each is a pretty definitive view tbf. | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:54 - Feb 28 with 2886 views | daveB |
Can someone get the crayons out and explain how that training ground bit works? I thought investments made in your infrastructure didn't count towards FFP. | | | |
| QPR Finances released on 09:56 - Feb 28 with 2868 views | joe90 |
| QPR Finances released on 09:32 - Feb 28 by Gloucs_R |
How do the finances compare to Millwall?
Both similar size London clubs. |
Just guessing but...
I imagine they're doing better than us because:
1: They've had a lower wage bill for longer
2: Running cost of the Den are lower
3: No FFP |  | | |
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