| Forest and Cooper 21:33 - Jan 4 with 4161 views | Dr_Parnassus |
As touched upon last week, they are really starting to click now. Pushed up into the mid table mix on the same points as Leicester and Leeds after another good result. Away wins in the Premier League are never easy, no matter who they are.
Nice to see a traditionally big club like that back where they belong, good on them. |  |
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| Forest and Cooper on 13:32 - Jan 5 with 1064 views | STID2017 |
I am very confused.
Which is better ?
Spending £150 million and lying in 15th ?
Or spending a fifth of that and lying in 7th ?
Getting conflicting views.
From my point of view i would be happier to be the 7th place and lower spend ? |  |
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| Forest and Cooper on 15:05 - Jan 5 with 1021 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Forest and Cooper on 13:32 - Jan 5 by STID2017 |
I am very confused.
Which is better ?
Spending £150 million and lying in 15th ?
Or spending a fifth of that and lying in 7th ?
Getting conflicting views.
From my point of view i would be happier to be the 7th place and lower spend ? |
The answer is history.
Notts who have been in League 1 or the Championship for the last 22 years.
Compared to
Fulham were lately only 1 Year in the Championship. They have been yoyoing between the Prem and the Championship over the last 20 years.
Which would you expect to have the better squad going back in to the Premier League and therefore not needing to spend so much money?
As a fan wouldn't you be absolutely over the moon to be 15th after languishing in the Championship and worse for 22 years |  | | |
| Forest and Cooper on 16:37 - Jan 5 with 981 views | STID2017 |
| Forest and Cooper on 15:05 - Jan 5 by A_Fans_Dad |
The answer is history.
Notts who have been in League 1 or the Championship for the last 22 years.
Compared to
Fulham were lately only 1 Year in the Championship. They have been yoyoing between the Prem and the Championship over the last 20 years.
Which would you expect to have the better squad going back in to the Premier League and therefore not needing to spend so much money?
As a fan wouldn't you be absolutely over the moon to be 15th after languishing in the Championship and worse for 22 years |
Good and fair answer.
Although I think Fulham fans must be very happy at the moment too. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 17:26 - Jan 5 with 959 views | A_Fans_Dad |
| Forest and Cooper on 16:37 - Jan 5 by STID2017 |
Good and fair answer.
Although I think Fulham fans must be very happy at the moment too. |
Yes, maybe this year they won't rebound back down again. | | | |
| Forest and Cooper on 19:46 - Jan 5 with 909 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Forest and Cooper on 13:32 - Jan 5 by STID2017 |
I am very confused.
Which is better ?
Spending £150 million and lying in 15th ?
Or spending a fifth of that and lying in 7th ?
Getting conflicting views.
From my point of view i would be happier to be the 7th place and lower spend ? |
It’s not a about what’s better, nobody is claiming Forest are doing better than every club in the league - we are discussing how Cooper is doing and how Forest are going against realistic expectations.
Forest should be expected to come in the bottom 3 based on spend + base squad, same as Fulham. They are both doing superbly well and exceeding those expectations. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 19:52 - Jan 5 with 905 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Forest and Cooper on 13:14 - Jan 5 by ReslovenSwan1 |
s this simply spend or Net spend (balance of transfer of money in for transfers and money out for transfers)
Forest did not sell much as Cooper to his credit took the team up with players of low transfer values.
Some argue "net" spend means nothing but it has to for FFP considerations. It mean nothing to the Sovereign wealth fund clubs but Forest are not that.
What Huw Jenkins did with Swansea was extraordinary as is becoming increasing apparent. Burnley have shadowed Swansea's achievement with one previous dip into the Championship and will probably return to the pL this season. Swansea failed under Potter after he failed to spend the £7m transfer money given to him wisely with the desperately poor signings of Asoro, McKay, John and Celina, |
Net spend means nothing (in the context of expectations), of course it matters to FFP considerations, what point are you making?
Again Steve Cooper had a net spend of +£53m over his reign, that should have been relegation then if compared to the rest of the league…. Or do you think it’s more sensible to go on squad value which incorporates money spent as well as inherited talent and compare against the competition?
Yeah me too. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 11:16 - Jan 6 with 844 views | vetchonian |
| Forest and Cooper on 19:46 - Jan 5 by Dr_Parnassus |
It’s not a about what’s better, nobody is claiming Forest are doing better than every club in the league - we are discussing how Cooper is doing and how Forest are going against realistic expectations.
Forest should be expected to come in the bottom 3 based on spend + base squad, same as Fulham. They are both doing superbly well and exceeding those expectations. |
You are wasting your time and energy on this there are several posters who are so prejudiced against Cooper including posting support of the team Forest plays they cannot see reality.
He is no longer our manager so im not that bothered about how he is doing yet when he was our manager the same individuals criticised him for his football despite us getting results whilst those of us who have dared criticise our current manager have been called not true supporters
Its amazing really when you look at Cooper and Martin both entered club management at around the same time but at different levels.
Cooper came here after we had finished 10th in the league at the end of his first season we finished 6th and lost in the play off semi finals at the end of his second season here we finished 4th again improving on the previous seasons standing losing the play off final to a team who had lost the final the season previous.
He left and in his third season in club management took a team from bottom of the league having joined 7 games in and having no preseason to winning the play off final and promotion to the PL. Now in his 4th season of club management finds his club 15th in the PL, yes still close to the bottom of the table but improving and also having to rebuild a team following the massive spend in the summer .
whilst Martin
in his first season finished 19th then in his second finished 13th he joined us had no preseason and took a club which had finished 4th to 15th in the table, now in his fourth season of management we find ourselves in 15th position in the table having only managed one win in ten games....
the excuses are thrown around that he hasn't the players to play his style ....would you honestly expect to find that quality of player in Lg1 or the Championship...whilst some teams may have one or two players of that ilk at this level there would not be squads full of them outside of the PL so why would a manager persist in something for which they have not the tools....Martinez changed our style of play wanting to move from the traditional lower league CBs hoofing it away by using a skillfull ball player in front of them to give them an outlet then added pace on the wings....he played to players strengths..what does our current manager do? | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 11:35 - Jan 6 with 832 views | KeithHaynes |
| Forest and Cooper on 11:16 - Jan 6 by vetchonian |
You are wasting your time and energy on this there are several posters who are so prejudiced against Cooper including posting support of the team Forest plays they cannot see reality.
He is no longer our manager so im not that bothered about how he is doing yet when he was our manager the same individuals criticised him for his football despite us getting results whilst those of us who have dared criticise our current manager have been called not true supporters
Its amazing really when you look at Cooper and Martin both entered club management at around the same time but at different levels.
Cooper came here after we had finished 10th in the league at the end of his first season we finished 6th and lost in the play off semi finals at the end of his second season here we finished 4th again improving on the previous seasons standing losing the play off final to a team who had lost the final the season previous.
He left and in his third season in club management took a team from bottom of the league having joined 7 games in and having no preseason to winning the play off final and promotion to the PL. Now in his 4th season of club management finds his club 15th in the PL, yes still close to the bottom of the table but improving and also having to rebuild a team following the massive spend in the summer .
whilst Martin
in his first season finished 19th then in his second finished 13th he joined us had no preseason and took a club which had finished 4th to 15th in the table, now in his fourth season of management we find ourselves in 15th position in the table having only managed one win in ten games....
the excuses are thrown around that he hasn't the players to play his style ....would you honestly expect to find that quality of player in Lg1 or the Championship...whilst some teams may have one or two players of that ilk at this level there would not be squads full of them outside of the PL so why would a manager persist in something for which they have not the tools....Martinez changed our style of play wanting to move from the traditional lower league CBs hoofing it away by using a skillfull ball player in front of them to give them an outlet then added pace on the wings....he played to players strengths..what does our current manager do? |
Is there a reference point for when you were called ‘ not true supporters ‘ ? |  |
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| Forest and Cooper on 11:38 - Jan 6 with 828 views | vetchonian |
| Forest and Cooper on 11:35 - Jan 6 by KeithHaynes |
Is there a reference point for when you were called ‘ not true supporters ‘ ? |
There were several posts where I and Martin's other critics had our "credentials" as supporters questioned if I had the time and inclination I could trawl through previous threads and find some reference...... | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 22:30 - Jan 14 with 714 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Another win tonight vs Leicester.
Up to 13th.
Combined with the Semi Finals of a major domestic trophy, there can’t be anyone left willing to claim he’s not doing fantastically well yet again… can there? | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 22:40 - Jan 14 with 679 views | KeithHaynes |
| Forest and Cooper on 11:38 - Jan 6 by vetchonian |
There were several posts where I and Martin's other critics had our "credentials" as supporters questioned if I had the time and inclination I could trawl through previous threads and find some reference...... |
You probably need to because I can’t find them. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 22:43 - Jan 14 with 675 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Forest and Cooper on 22:30 - Jan 14 by Dr_Parnassus |
Another win tonight vs Leicester.
Up to 13th.
Combined with the Semi Finals of a major domestic trophy, there can’t be anyone left willing to claim he’s not doing fantastically well yet again… can there? |
No true fan with any football knowledge can deny that Cooper has got more out of his players every season judging by the positions his teams finish each season. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 22:59 - Jan 14 with 654 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Forest and Cooper on 22:43 - Jan 14 by felixstowe_jack |
No true fan with any football knowledge can deny that Cooper has got more out of his players every season judging by the positions his teams finish each season. |
He’s overcome everything that has been used as an excuse elsewhere.
No pre season
New players
Another managers squad
No time to teach players his methods
No money (last year)
Young manager
Only been managing few years still learning
Every one of those has been used elsewhere to excuse awful performances from managers. Not only has Cooper made those excuses look ludicrous but he’s smashed them to smithereens. | |
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| Forest and Cooper on 23:01 - Jan 14 with 649 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Forest and Cooper on 22:40 - Jan 14 by KeithHaynes |
You probably need to because I can’t find them. |
To be fair I recall many suggesting I’m not a real Swansea fan because I criticised the manager in one form or another.
The search function is barely useable on here for some reason but I could probably find a fair few given enough time.
It may not be the exact words but said in the usual underhand way like “you love it when we lose”, “you must be gutted we won today”, “I’m a real supporter and support”.
That sort of thing. It is all suggesting that you are not a true Swansea fan if you have criticised the manager that has underperformed in his entire 18 month reign.
Praising Cooper for doing well also leads people to say that they should go and support them etc etc [Post edited 14 Jan 2023 23:13]
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| Forest and Cooper on 23:25 - Jan 14 with 630 views | majorraglan |
| Forest and Cooper on 22:30 - Jan 14 by Dr_Parnassus |
Another win tonight vs Leicester.
Up to 13th.
Combined with the Semi Finals of a major domestic trophy, there can’t be anyone left willing to claim he’s not doing fantastically well yet again… can there? |
Looking at his record in management, my take is that he’s done exceptionally well. Success with the England youth teams, Play offs twice with the Swans and once with Forest. It’s early days, but after a tough start at the midway point Forest have 20 points and lower mid table and a league cup semi final to look forward to. | | | |
| Forest and Cooper on 00:44 - Jan 15 with 584 views | raynor94 |
Gibbs White is on fire, if only he hadn't picked up that injury with us |  |
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| Forest and Cooper on 06:46 - Jan 15 with 560 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Forest and Cooper on 23:25 - Jan 14 by majorraglan |
Looking at his record in management, my take is that he’s done exceptionally well. Success with the England youth teams, Play offs twice with the Swans and once with Forest. It’s early days, but after a tough start at the midway point Forest have 20 points and lower mid table and a league cup semi final to look forward to. |
Career win % of 47.46%
To put that into perspective, that’s higher than both Ole Gunnar Solskjaer and Ralf Rangnick managed with Man United last season. | |
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