| The Verdict 08:48 - Sep 25 with 2603 views | kingolaf |
Can’t wait to see Nick’s synopsis of the game.
No doubt another stoic defence of the manager and the need for a geriatric who can talk at the back. |  | | |  |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 with 2557 views | SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |  |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 09:35 - Sep 25 with 2543 views | saints__fan__73 |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |
Who else to blame for the mess other than the manager and the idiots who own/'run' the club?
We have a squad the likes of Preston and Birmingham would dream of yet we have lost our last 4 games (in the 2nd tier) by a combined total of 12-2. |  |
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| The Verdict on 10:36 - Sep 25 with 2484 views | kingslandstand1 |
| The Verdict on 09:35 - Sep 25 by saints__fan__73 |
Who else to blame for the mess other than the manager and the idiots who own/'run' the club?
We have a squad the likes of Preston and Birmingham would dream of yet we have lost our last 4 games (in the 2nd tier) by a combined total of 12-2. |
The fans ................  |  | | |
| The Verdict on 10:47 - Sep 25 with 2453 views | kingslandstand1 |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |
Tbf, the manager can only work with the tools he is given as in any job, but he seems to be persistent in the style of play which we don't seem able to do without a mistake
I've only seen Saturday's 1st goal of theirs on tv but that again was an awful error giving the ball away needlessly and you cannot blame the manager for a player who can't pass the ball to a player wearing the same colour shirt
What you can blame him for though is PICKING those players who cannot pass when he can surely see their strengths in training during the week
We have to accept that we have a cr@p squad but surely he can see which players are good enough to play his (or is it above him who decides what style of football to play?
What I would like to know though is who ACTUALLY signs these players that are clearly not good enough
I'd also say that we have to wait a few more games before embarrassing ourselves again with another change of manager, but is RM so daft that he can't see the errors on the pitch, but also that he doesn't try and change a style of play that is not working | | | |
| The Verdict on 10:48 - Sep 25 with 2452 views | arfurdent |
as the great Harry Rednapp said" it's all tomorrows chip paper" |  |
| And the White Knight is talking backwards
And the Red Queen's off with her head |
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| The Verdict on 10:52 - Sep 25 with 2447 views | kingolaf |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |
Yep, that’s about the size of it.
Appointing Martin was the Football equivalent of making Liz Truss Prime Minister. | | | |
| The Verdict on 10:53 - Sep 25 with 2444 views | saintwizzler |
Nathan Jones was sacked after 14 games. 5 wins, 9 losses.
17 games for Russell Martin including the cup defeat would take us up to the international break in November.
That should be given to him in my opinion.
Rusty currently stands on - 9 games played, 3 wins, 1 draw, 5 losses. |  |
| We thought that we had the answers,
It was the questions we had wrong. |
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| The Verdict on 12:55 - Sep 25 with 2325 views | SaintNick |
| The Verdict on 10:53 - Sep 25 by saintwizzler |
Nathan Jones was sacked after 14 games. 5 wins, 9 losses.
17 games for Russell Martin including the cup defeat would take us up to the international break in November.
That should be given to him in my opinion.
Rusty currently stands on - 9 games played, 3 wins, 1 draw, 5 losses. |
I judge him on league form only that is what counts, nothing else | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 13:07 - Sep 25 with 2295 views | PatfromPoole |
| The Verdict on 12:55 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
I judge him on league form only that is what counts, nothing else |
Why whenever his name comes up do you refer to Hassenhutl getting us to a semi-final and a quarter-final? |  |
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| The Verdict on 13:09 - Sep 25 with 2292 views | saintwizzler |
| The Verdict on 12:55 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
I judge him on league form only that is what counts, nothing else |
Lolz
16 league games until the November international break then.
A third of the league season. | |
| We thought that we had the answers,
It was the questions we had wrong. |
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| The Verdict on 13:17 - Sep 25 with 2272 views | SaintNick |
| The Verdict on 13:09 - Sep 25 by saintwizzler |
Lolz
16 league games until the November international break then.
A third of the league season. |
The truth is that is not enough to judge him by, it needs to be a longer period ie until Xmas, if Russell Martin wins the next 5 games and we are in the play off spots by that 16th game, how much time does that buy him, I'm sure that he will still be criticised and people will say he has fluked a few wins so we now have to judge him at Xmas.
Even if we stormed to promotion as Champions there will still be those who will say he can't be judged until 16 games in the Premier League. | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 13:18 - Sep 25 with 2269 views | TimSaint |
| The Verdict on 12:55 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
I judge him on league form only that is what counts, nothing else |
...unless we had won that Cup match at Gillingham !! :-)
Seriously though, I remember years back, when you used to look at our games in the Prem in little groups of 3 - with the aim of getting 5 or 6 points from each little group.
As our current league form is non-existent, how do you recommend us analysing our up and coming fixtures ? |  |
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| The Verdict on 13:20 - Sep 25 with 2265 views | SaintNick |
| The Verdict on 13:07 - Sep 25 by PatfromPoole |
Why whenever his name comes up do you refer to Hassenhutl getting us to a semi-final and a quarter-final? |
Because Hasenhuttl was managing in the Premier League and we were looking for him to push on and actually challenge for something.
Russell Martin's sole job is to get us back to the Premier League, he is not going to have a chance of winning us a cup, so I am not going to judge him on the fact that he put out a reserve side at Gillingham | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 13:28 - Sep 25 with 2220 views | PatfromPoole |
| The Verdict on 13:17 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
The truth is that is not enough to judge him by, it needs to be a longer period ie until Xmas, if Russell Martin wins the next 5 games and we are in the play off spots by that 16th game, how much time does that buy him, I'm sure that he will still be criticised and people will say he has fluked a few wins so we now have to judge him at Xmas.
Even if we stormed to promotion as Champions there will still be those who will say he can't be judged until 16 games in the Premier League. |
Russell Martin will say that he needs a minimum of two years to overhaul the way we play and to address the “scar tissue” which has beset (a proportion of) the squad.
He has already begun to play the PR game and get his excuses in.
Throwing Alcaraz under the bus is just part of his PR game.
There will be plenty more of this spin to come.
I think PR spin must be one of Ankersen’s infamous reference points.
TRUST THE PROCESS. [Post edited 25 Sep 2023 13:36]
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| The Verdict on 13:37 - Sep 25 with 2197 views | SaintNick |
| The Verdict on 13:28 - Sep 25 by PatfromPoole |
Russell Martin will say that he needs a minimum of two years to overhaul the way we play and to address the “scar tissue” which has beset (a proportion of) the squad.
He has already begun to play the PR game and get his excuses in.
Throwing Alcaraz under the bus is just part of his PR game.
There will be plenty more of this spin to come.
I think PR spin must be one of Ankersen’s infamous reference points.
TRUST THE PROCESS. [Post edited 25 Sep 2023 13:36]
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That sounds like you are discussing the situation when Saints got relegated in 1974, McMenemy took 4 years to get us back to the top flight though, but he had to completely overhaul a squad full of players who took us down in 1974, 9 of the 12 on duty at Wembley in 1976 who played in 73/74 season.
By 1978 there were just two left and the job got done, lucky we didn't judge McMenemy by the first 16 games of 1975/76 season, although many by then had made up their minds about him, | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 13:48 - Sep 25 with 2178 views | PatfromPoole |
| The Verdict on 13:37 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
That sounds like you are discussing the situation when Saints got relegated in 1974, McMenemy took 4 years to get us back to the top flight though, but he had to completely overhaul a squad full of players who took us down in 1974, 9 of the 12 on duty at Wembley in 1976 who played in 73/74 season.
By 1978 there were just two left and the job got done, lucky we didn't judge McMenemy by the first 16 games of 1975/76 season, although many by then had made up their minds about him, |
Are we now using 1974 as the barometer for analysis of our plight?
Hardly comparing apples with apples, is it? | |
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| The Verdict on 14:05 - Sep 25 with 2163 views | Butty101 |
| The Verdict on 13:20 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Because Hasenhuttl was managing in the Premier League and we were looking for him to push on and actually challenge for something.
Russell Martin's sole job is to get us back to the Premier League, he is not going to have a chance of winning us a cup, so I am not going to judge him on the fact that he put out a reserve side at Gillingham |
As you always like to compare to yesteryear, had we had that approach when Lawrie Mac was manager, we wouldn’t have a cup win to our name. [Post edited 25 Sep 2023 14:06]
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| The Verdict on 14:07 - Sep 25 with 2144 views | SalisburySaint |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |
Agreed Nick, If Lawrie had only been given only 8 games, we probably wouldn’t have won the FA CUP or made it back to Division One, signed Keegan and had some of the best years in the Top Flight.
Things aren’t right that’s for sure, but imo he needs to be given more time |  | | |
| The Verdict on 14:57 - Sep 25 with 2090 views | SonicBoom |
For me there are more possibilities than we are either great and love RM, or we're terrible and he must be sacked.
My complaint would be that he's had quite a while to coach into the players this "totally new way of playing" - yet when I watch the team they don't seem to have a clue how to play it. In fact we look a disorganised mess. They are clearly told to play out from the back but they clearly look completely uncomfortable with it and every week they look more nervous.
So I don't want RM sacked but I do want to see him show some flexibility. Maybe dont try to change the entire style in one big move. How about slowly integrating the new style. Moving towards how he wants to play slowly.
I'd give any manager until Christmas anyway but surely he can see it isn't working.
As Nick always says the definition of madness is doing the same thing and expecting different results. Well every week RM sends out the team to play his style and currently we are turned over by everyone. |  | | |
| The Verdict on 15:18 - Sep 25 with 2072 views | Chesham_Saint |
| The Verdict on 09:19 - Sep 25 by SaintNick |
Why do you think that anyone who does not rant and rave and demand sackings and new owners is stoically defending.
What you get is my opinion as a fan of long standing, I don't defend the manager, all I have ever said is that he should be given a fair crack of the whip.
Is 8 games a fair crack of the whip for a manager, are you and others really such experts on football that you can tell after only 8 games and far less for some that he is not up to the job ?
From your last comment, you seem to feel the solution is not a lack of leadership on the pitch and that just changing the manager will immediately lead to solid performances on the pitch |
8 games may not be a lot but:
A) Factor in his very modest performance at his previous club and
B) consider the utterly pathetic way we have performed thus far this season.
I put it to you that the sensible, rationale conclusion is to fire him now.
Frankly I’d rather see you as manager than this halfwit. At least you live nearer the club! |  |
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| The Verdict on 17:29 - Sep 26 with 1810 views | DorsetIan |
| The Verdict on 10:47 - Sep 25 by kingslandstand1 |
Tbf, the manager can only work with the tools he is given as in any job, but he seems to be persistent in the style of play which we don't seem able to do without a mistake
I've only seen Saturday's 1st goal of theirs on tv but that again was an awful error giving the ball away needlessly and you cannot blame the manager for a player who can't pass the ball to a player wearing the same colour shirt
What you can blame him for though is PICKING those players who cannot pass when he can surely see their strengths in training during the week
We have to accept that we have a cr@p squad but surely he can see which players are good enough to play his (or is it above him who decides what style of football to play?
What I would like to know though is who ACTUALLY signs these players that are clearly not good enough
I'd also say that we have to wait a few more games before embarrassing ourselves again with another change of manager, but is RM so daft that he can't see the errors on the pitch, but also that he doesn't try and change a style of play that is not working |
How can a professional footballer not be able to pass ffs.
They can all pass.
They’re rattled. They make mistakes. And because we are playing such a stupid ‘wide open at the back’ system. Mistakes are leading to very very soft goals | |
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| The Verdict on 12:49 - Sep 27 with 1601 views | SaintNick |
| The Verdict on 17:29 - Sep 26 by DorsetIan |
How can a professional footballer not be able to pass ffs.
They can all pass.
They’re rattled. They make mistakes. And because we are playing such a stupid ‘wide open at the back’ system. Mistakes are leading to very very soft goals |
There are plenty of professional footballers whose passing ability isnt brilliant, they are usually central defenders or holding midfield players, but a fair few centre forwards cant pass either. | |
| Satisfying The Bloodlust Of The Masses In Peacetime |
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| The Verdict on 13:49 - Sep 27 with 1569 views | saint901 |
| The Verdict on 12:49 - Sep 27 by SaintNick |
There are plenty of professional footballers whose passing ability isnt brilliant, they are usually central defenders or holding midfield players, but a fair few centre forwards cant pass either. |
So if we have players who can't/won't ever be able to play this way, why does RM continue to insist we use this system?
The experienced pros are not going to suddenly become better passers of the ball. | | | |
| The Verdict on 15:37 - Sep 27 with 1535 views | SonicBoom |
I think that's the key, our system isn't working and doesn't look any better now than it did a month ago.
In fact we look worse. So surely a decent manager would adapt his style to suit the players he has. If he stubbornly decides to stick rigidly to his current plan I can see things going south very fast. | | | |
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