| Clydach murders on 17:03 - Oct 29 with 2157 views | exhmrc1 |
| Clydach murders on 16:49 - Oct 29 by chad |
And ExH2 the first decision was quashed was it not due to conflict of interest of his brief. So it is rather disingenuous to count that as a fair verdict, if you believe in the legal process, as you seem to do |
The solicitor explained to him the position. He knew the score but asked the solicitor to carry on representing him. I agree the solicitor shouln't have acted for him but Morris was aware of the position as well. I doubt it had any effect on the Jury's decision. The second jury came to the same verdict. Unanimous both times. There was a second trial in the interest of fairness. |  | |  |
| Clydach murders on 17:15 - Oct 29 with 2147 views | chad |
| Clydach murders on 17:03 - Oct 29 by exhmrc1 |
The solicitor explained to him the position. He knew the score but asked the solicitor to carry on representing him. I agree the solicitor shouln't have acted for him but Morris was aware of the position as well. I doubt it had any effect on the Jury's decision. The second jury came to the same verdict. Unanimous both times. There was a second trial in the interest of fairness. |
Of course it had an effect. Morris’s solicitor had given Lewis assurances that they would not accuse him, which obviously massively disadvantages Morris, as their potential guilt throws reasonable doubt on Morris’s guilt.
The first guilty verdict was overruled. So to continuously raise that looks desperate as it was not sound. Surely him being ruled guilty once is enough for you, without keep including a quashed decision. Otherwise others could say he was not found guilty in the first case because the decision was legally overturned. |  | | |
| Clydach murders on 17:21 - Oct 29 with 2142 views | exhmrc1 |
| Clydach murders on 17:15 - Oct 29 by chad |
Of course it had an effect. Morris’s solicitor had given Lewis assurances that they would not accuse him, which obviously massively disadvantages Morris, as their potential guilt throws reasonable doubt on Morris’s guilt.
The first guilty verdict was overruled. So to continuously raise that looks desperate as it was not sound. Surely him being ruled guilty once is enough for you, without keep including a quashed decision. Otherwise others could say he was not found guilty in the first case because the decision was legally overturned. |
The first guilty decision was still unanimous, The second unanimous. He knew the position regarding Hutchinson and Lewis but still wanted him to represent him. He had the option to choose another solicitor but chose not to. As I say it would have been better if Hutchinson refused to take the case so no accusation could have taken place. | | | |
| Clydach murders on 17:33 - Oct 29 with 2135 views | chad |
| Clydach murders on 17:21 - Oct 29 by exhmrc1 |
The first guilty decision was still unanimous, The second unanimous. He knew the position regarding Hutchinson and Lewis but still wanted him to represent him. He had the option to choose another solicitor but chose not to. As I say it would have been better if Hutchinson refused to take the case so no accusation could have taken place. |
Keep repeating it does not make the result valid, conflict of interest is serious and solicitors should be very aware of that. Did The solicitor tell Morris he had agreed not to accuse Lewis of guilt , i don’t think so. The first verdict does not count, in fact let us say he was obviously not found guilty, as that decision has no legal authority as it was overturned.
So once not guilty, once guilty, surely 50% is reasonable doubt.
See how daft it is putting any legal authority into the first case? | | | |
| Clydach murders on 17:40 - Oct 29 with 2129 views | exhmrc1 |
| Clydach murders on 17:33 - Oct 29 by chad |
Keep repeating it does not make the result valid, conflict of interest is serious and solicitors should be very aware of that. Did The solicitor tell Morris he had agreed not to accuse Lewis of guilt , i don’t think so. The first verdict does not count, in fact let us say he was obviously not found guilty, as that decision has no legal authority as it was overturned.
So once not guilty, once guilty, surely 50% is reasonable doubt.
See how daft it is putting any legal authority into the first case? |
The problem is that if Hutchinson had not represented him as he wanted we would now have people claiming he was denied his first choice solicitor just as the BBC have claimed his second legal team should have raised the time scale and psychologist. As I say it would have been better and cleaner if Hutchinson who had represented him earlier and he trusted had not taken the case. It doesnt alter what the jury decided though. They heard the case and were satisfied with his guilt and the second jury did the same with a different legal team.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/wales/4267631.stm [Post edited 29 Oct 2020 17:43]
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| Clydach murders on 17:43 - Oct 29 with 2110 views | trampie |
It was up to Hutchinson to say. |  |
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| Clydach murders on 17:43 - Oct 29 with 2117 views | Yyy |
| Clydach murders on 16:41 - Oct 29 by exhmrc1 |
I just find it extremely odd you are on here and the only thing you ever seem to post on is this case. Why.
As far as this case. There are some facts.
Morris chain was found in the house. He denied for ages it was his. Then when he realised they had evidence it was his he changed his story and said he had left it there the day before when having sex. At the same time he claimed this his phone records show he was at home. 2 juries heard his evidence. They saw his behaviour in court and that of Alison Lewis. Both juries rejected his defence and unanimously decided twice he was guilty without reasonable doubt.
I assume as in all legal trials his Barristers had the right to reject 3 jurors and would be stunned if hadn't done so.
He claimed to not have been at the house and walked to Llangyfelach via Craig Cefn Parc and then back. A distance close on 9 miles in the pouring rain. His then girlfriend contradicted this claiming he was at home.
Basically the 2 juries didnt believe his story. His appeals have been considered and rejected by people totally unconnected by anyone involved in this.
We have a totally one sided BBC programme that doesnt even give the prosecution the right to explain itself although they probably wouldnt be allowed to for legal reasons.
They use 3 witnesses to try to attack people who havent been charged or tried. One claims to have seen the brothers half a mile away on a busy road. The 2 guys are coppers who more than most would know how important not being seen would have been. Yet the programme doesnt even question him over that. Another guy claims to have seen Lewis on a lonely mountain road supposedly after the murders. That road eventually leads to the coppers house approximately 4 miles away. Again he isnt questioned and his view accepted. Is it likely that a copper who knows the importance of not being seen would be walking 4 miles over a mountain or what he have a getaway vehicle close by.
The other witness claims to have seen Lewis and never seen him before but went to the same gym as him.
The bottom line is the important people twice found him guilty irrespective of mine or your view. |
I dont know what you find odd,i have frequented the site regularly for a long time but have never felt the need to post previously.
It was actually the inaccuracies in your own posts on that's his topic prompted me to actually join and post on this thread.
You never know now that i am a member you maybe seeing else where on this site.
Hope you are looking forward to it as much as me.
Yes i know what the facts are with regards to morris,please point me in the direction where i have disputed these
I have continually posted that i am sure if morris is innocent ir guilty.
You have made various attempts to imply that i am a morris supporter,when i am on the fence.
Do i agree with your rationale to be confident in Morris's guilt? No i dont,you seem to have great difficulty having an objective view.
You fail to note the phone calls Mandy made to morris on valentine's day,they would imply affair was going on
You fail to mention stephen lewis also lied about going in the house,but then changed his story to going into every room and even touching the pole.
Or that Stephen lewis said he lite a match to light mandy cooker.it was reported her cooker was electric(spent matches left behind with unknow dna)
Or that his death threat was a joke again he lied(looks like morris wasnt the only one changing his story)
You also fail to mention morris dna is not there but alison lewis was and stephen lewis fingerprint were found in the house.
This is just to name a few
Given the evidence against all parties i think anyone of them would have been given a guilty verdict.
Does that mean the other are innocent?i dont think it does | | | |
| Clydach murders (n/t) on 18:19 - Oct 29 with 3974 views | exhmrc1 |
| Clydach murders on 17:43 - Oct 29 by Yyy |
I dont know what you find odd,i have frequented the site regularly for a long time but have never felt the need to post previously.
It was actually the inaccuracies in your own posts on that's his topic prompted me to actually join and post on this thread.
You never know now that i am a member you maybe seeing else where on this site.
Hope you are looking forward to it as much as me.
Yes i know what the facts are with regards to morris,please point me in the direction where i have disputed these
I have continually posted that i am sure if morris is innocent ir guilty.
You have made various attempts to imply that i am a morris supporter,when i am on the fence.
Do i agree with your rationale to be confident in Morris's guilt? No i dont,you seem to have great difficulty having an objective view.
You fail to note the phone calls Mandy made to morris on valentine's day,they would imply affair was going on
You fail to mention stephen lewis also lied about going in the house,but then changed his story to going into every room and even touching the pole.
Or that Stephen lewis said he lite a match to light mandy cooker.it was reported her cooker was electric(spent matches left behind with unknow dna)
Or that his death threat was a joke again he lied(looks like morris wasnt the only one changing his story)
You also fail to mention morris dna is not there but alison lewis was and stephen lewis fingerprint were found in the house.
This is just to name a few
Given the evidence against all parties i think anyone of them would have been given a guilty verdict.
Does that mean the other are innocent?i dont think it does |
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| Clydach murders on 18:49 - Oct 29 with 3940 views | Neath_Jack |
| Clydach murders on 21:52 - Oct 28 by Flashberryjack |
How do you know he knows nothing different to the rest of us ?
Unless he's stated earlier in the thread, how do you know he wasn't in the courtroom ?
And yes, people do align to those we deem to be on our side, we all do it quite often. |
How do i know? Because I'm reading what he is posting.
He posts opinions and wrong facts.
Call it a hunch. |  |
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| Clydach murders on 19:02 - Oct 29 with 3915 views | Flashberryjack |
| Clydach murders on 18:49 - Oct 29 by Neath_Jack |
How do i know? Because I'm reading what he is posting.
He posts opinions and wrong facts.
Call it a hunch. |
Which facts of his facts is wrong ? |  |
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| Clydach murders on 19:04 - Oct 29 with 3908 views | Neath_Jack |
| Clydach murders on 19:02 - Oct 29 by Flashberryjack |
Which facts of his facts is wrong ? |
Have a read butt, I'm not going to reproduce them here for you.
It isn't the point though, the point being he knows no more than anyone else on this thread. | |
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| Clydach murders on 19:13 - Oct 29 with 3899 views | Flashberryjack |
| Clydach murders on 19:04 - Oct 29 by Neath_Jack |
Have a read butt, I'm not going to reproduce them here for you.
It isn't the point though, the point being he knows no more than anyone else on this thread. |
Then I guess we'll agree to disagree, because I can't be arsed to reproduce them either. | |
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| Clydach murders on 09:43 - Nov 3 with 3647 views | whiterock |
I'm still not convinced, if I was in Morris’ corner I’d open up the case to Mark Williams-Thomas, a former police detective who is now an award winning investigative reporter and criminologist. BBC Wales did not give us any thing we didn't know already. | | | |
| Clydach murders on 09:45 - Nov 3 with 3643 views | whiterock |
| Clydach murders on 09:43 - Nov 3 by whiterock |
I'm still not convinced, if I was in Morris’ corner I’d open up the case to Mark Williams-Thomas, a former police detective who is now an award winning investigative reporter and criminologist. BBC Wales did not give us any thing we didn't know already. |
About Mark
Mark is a multi award winning investigative reporter and has amongst his awards, two Royal Television Society, a Broadcasting Press Guild and an International Peabody. He is also BAFTA nominated.
He is a former police detective and a criminologist who has far-reaching experience of working at the centre of high profile investigations and undertaking major reviews. Mark has over the last decade reported on nearly all the biggest crime stories including: Oscar Pistorius, The Alps murders, Tia Sharp murder, Claudia Lawrence murder, the murder of Alice Gross and the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.
One of Mark’s greatest skills is his ability to get exclusive access and interviews with key people related to the cases.
It was Mark’s programme in 2012 for ITV’s Exposure that finally exposed Jimmy Savile as one of the nations worst ever paedophiles. As a direct result of Mark’s investigation, the Metropolitan police set up Operation Yewtree which led to the arrest of high profile celebrities Rolf Harris and Max Clifford.
In 2015 Mark beat the world’s media to gain exclusive access to Oscar Pistorius and his programme ‘Oscar Pistorius: The Interview’ was broadcast on ITV 24th June 2016 and the show has subsequently been broadcast around the world. In 2016 after a year long investigation Mark was given his own prime time ITV crime show — The Investigator. His first series reviewed the murder of Carole Packman who went missing in 1985, and whilst her husband is in jail for her murder, her body has never been found. As a direct result of this series and the NEW evidence Mark found, Dorset police have now re-opened the case. The Investigator is currently being shown worldwide on Netflix.
In February 2016 Mark was given his own crime strand on ITV’s This Morning — ‘Unsolved’ which looked at undetected crime. His first three cases were the murders of Jill Dando and Claudia Lawrence and the disappearance of the Malaysian flight MH370.
2017 and the first part of 2018 was taken with Mark making Series 2 of his prime time ITV crime series The Investigator which broadcast in April 2018. Mark is currently working on a number of different murder re-investigations which are closely guarded at this stage. | | | |
| Clydach murders on 18:28 - Nov 10 with 3471 views | britferry |
speaking to 2 new witnesses, there were 3 on the program, I bet I know which one didnt get spoken to | |
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| Clydach murders on 19:37 - Nov 10 with 3421 views | exhmrc1 |
It was probably the woman. She had ben spoken to previously. | | | |
| Clydach murders on 17:32 - Jan 19 with 2977 views | pikeypaul |
And everyone should welcome this with open arms, if it is independent and carried out without interference.
Hopefully it throws something definitive up one way or the other.
The bottom line is that we all want the true killer/ killers convicted . |  |
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| Clydach murders on 17:34 - Jan 19 with 2976 views | Whiterockin |
| Clydach murders on 17:32 - Jan 19 by pikeypaul |
And everyone should welcome this with open arms, if it is independent and carried out without interference.
Hopefully it throws something definitive up one way or the other.
The bottom line is that we all want the true killer/ killers convicted . |
And in fairness if the killer has been convicted we want to end any doubt. |  | | |
| Clydach murders on 17:43 - Jan 19 with 2948 views | trampie |
| Clydach murders on 17:32 - Jan 19 by pikeypaul |
And everyone should welcome this with open arms, if it is independent and carried out without interference.
Hopefully it throws something definitive up one way or the other.
The bottom line is that we all want the true killer/ killers convicted . |
Indeed something definitive one way or the other would be very good but there is also a chance of things being inconclusive unfortunately. | |
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| Clydach murders on 19:39 - Jan 19 with 2875 views | pikeypaul |
Just read the report.
So it’s SWP appointing one of their own to investigate their past actions.
Total waste of time and another whitewash.
Nothing will come from this one way or the other, they will still not get ANY forensics proving Morris was the culprit. | |
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| Clydach murders on 19:42 - Jan 19 with 2868 views | trampie |
| Clydach murders on 19:39 - Jan 19 by pikeypaul |
Just read the report.
So it’s SWP appointing one of their own to investigate their past actions.
Total waste of time and another whitewash.
Nothing will come from this one way or the other, they will still not get ANY forensics proving Morris was the culprit. |
Oh that does not sound good. | |
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| Clydach murders on 12:03 - Jan 20 with 2776 views | whiterock |
There are mitigating circumstances either way, so testing for new DNA has to be welcomed which ever side of the fence you sit. | | | |
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